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And when we have them, insurance pays out.

I think the argument of WABA and others is that they don't. That the insurance companies are denying claims without a plausible basis. Perhaps that's not happening. Perhaps there is no need for a change. But this isn't the only example that disproves that.

by David C in Breakfast links: Vote early on Oct 25, 2014 12:15 am • linkreport

#2 14th and T St NW
#4 Cheverly Station
#5 Building Museum as viewed from Nat'l Law Enforcement Mem'l
#6 10th and U St NW in Shaw.

by transitlover in Name these spots in the Flickr pool on Oct 24, 2014 10:02 pm • linkreport

The opposite (west) end of the VRE trail connects with the station at Roberts Road. IMHO, Roberts would be an excellent north-south connecting route: south would take you to the Fairfax County Parkway, where there is a trail that connects with Va Rte 123; and north takes you to George Mason University and Fairfax City.

Roberts Road, however, is currently a very poor cycling alternative. It is narrow with no shoulders in places, and encourages fast drivers. This entire corridor was opened up about 15 years ago when Roberts was pushed through. At the time, there was apparently very little consideration of cycling. It is time to take that up.

by Arrgh_Street in New bike lanes will close a big trail gap in Burke on Oct 24, 2014 9:37 pm • linkreport

Yes. But some of us can record thousands of miles a year without such problems. And when we have them, insurance pays out.

by Crickey7 in Breakfast links: Vote early on Oct 24, 2014 9:32 pm • linkreport

Falls Church, I can promise you that Carlyle is the commonly used name for the Carlyle section of Alexandria.

The area immediately near the Eisenhower Ave metro is often known as "Eisenhower East".

by alexandrian in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 8:48 pm • linkreport

In #3, the gray townhouse is 1707 N St NW

by logandude in Name these spots in the Flickr pool on Oct 24, 2014 7:54 pm • linkreport

Getting on the bike assumes risk.

by David C in Breakfast links: Vote early on Oct 24, 2014 7:25 pm • linkreport

inconvenient truth about streetcars that few here like to admit: http://www.humantransit.org/2009/07/streetcars-an-inconvenient-truth.html

by Matt in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 6:15 pm • linkreport

and how much could $3.1 billion buy in new buses, lane striping, signal prioritization, street-side smart-trip machines, and other components of a lane-separated BRT program?

That's not a realistic option - the whole reason the streetcar is in mixed-traffic is because there is no popular or political appetite, anywhere in the city, for taking away car lanes to dedicate to transit. It sucks, but it's the truth at the moment.

by Dizzy in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 5:44 pm • linkreport

1 is 1300 block of Massachusetts Avenue NE on Capitol Hill
2 is U Street, looking west toward Florida Avenue from 14th Street or so
5 is the National Building Museum from Judiciary Square
6 may be 12th and L Streets NW, looking east.

by Kim T in Name these spots in the Flickr pool on Oct 24, 2014 5:39 pm • linkreport

@alurin

Here's what I'm suggesting:

1) Name the station after the commonly used neighborhood name

2) If none exists, name the station after something recognizable as a location that could also work as a neighborhood name. Naming the station after the person associated with the street the station sits on would fit that bill.

3) Keep the name short

Maybe McPherson wouldn't catch on as a place name even if the station was named that. In that case, the advantage of naming the station McPherson would only be a shorter name.

by Falls Church in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 5:23 pm • linkreport

alurin: Though the T station names don't have "Square" in them: the stops are Alewife, Davis, Harvard, Central, Kendall not Alewife Brook, Davis Square, Harvard Square, etc. Though then it's Park Street.

Also, none of the squares have anything remotely square in them, possibly excluding Central, but that's a different issue.

by David Alpert in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 5:20 pm • linkreport

and how much could $3.1 billion buy in new buses, lane striping, signal prioritization, street-side smart-trip machines, and other components of a lane-separated BRT program? I'm pretty sure that is cheaper than a streetcar, and bikes wouldn't wipe out when trying to cross it.

by sbc in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 5:20 pm • linkreport

@Falls Church: Your original argumentseemed to be that we should name the stations after people, rather than streets coincidentally named after people.
I don't know about "Eisenhower", but if "McPherson Square" hasn't caught on as a neighborhood name, then I doubt "McPherson" would. Focal points like Dupont Circle, Logan Circle, or Lincoln Park often become toponyms for the broader neighborhood, whether or not there is a Metro stop there.
I moved down here from the Boston area, where almost all neighborhoods are "squares". Central Square, Harvard Square, Davis Square, Ball Square, Union Square, all give their names to areas larger than just an intersection; note that some of these squares have T stops and some don't.

by alurin in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 5:08 pm • linkreport

If the stations were named Eisenhower and Van Dorn instead of Eisenhower Ave and Van Dorn St, I'm pretty sure people would still figure out where it is. Just as people know where Clarendon station is even though the station isn't called Clarendon Blvd.

Generally, I agree with you, though. Don't name stations after unused neighborhood names like Parker-Gray or Carlyle. Instead, let the stations create commonly used names for the neighborhoods. However, if you're going to do that, then you would want to drop the "Ave, St, Blvd" etc. suffixes off the station names to make the station names sound more like neighborhood names. That will encourage adoption.

by Falls Church in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 5:05 pm • linkreport

@scoot: "$3.1B would actually buy a lot of Metrorail service within DC."

$3 billion is about the cost of the Silver Line 1st phase, which consists of 5 stations, all above ground, much of it in existing ROW that was essentially donated by MWAA. Seems like that might cover one or two underground stations, but not much more than that for DC.

by Jacques in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 5:04 pm • linkreport

I'm sure if you dug about studies about politicians on this element, the research results would confirm my hypotheses/assertions. whatever...

by Richard Layman in David Catania on Metro, economic development, streetcars, affordable housing, bike lanes, building heights, and more on Oct 24, 2014 4:55 pm • linkreport

This neighborhood stuff is just...meh to me. The four Alexandria stations are named after streets so you can figure out where in Alexandria they are. Subdividing it into odd little neighborhoods that have vague definitions doesn't really help getting around. I lived in Parker-Gray and I'm still not entirely sure where Parker-Gray is. And if I said I lived in Parker-Gray people would look at me like I just stepped out of my flying saucer direct from Mars. But everyone knows where Braddock Road is.

by Another Nick in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 4:51 pm • linkreport

@Thad

The second link you provided shows that the Eisenhower metro station is in fact in the Eisenhower Valley and not in Carlyle.

by Falls Church in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 4:41 pm • linkreport

@Thad

Carlyle may be the name, but is it a "commonly used name" as I said in my post? The area by NoMa station also had a name -- Swampoodle -- but it had not been commonly used for decades. There is no Census Designated Place called Carlyle in Alexandria, nothing in Google Maps or wikipedia, and little trace of it on the internet other than the link you cited.

Based on that link, it looks like the Visitor's Bureau calls the neighborhood Carlyle & Eisenhower. I suggest keeping it simple and calling it Eisenhower. Then, name the metro station after the neighborhood.

by Falls Church in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 4:37 pm • linkreport

@Richard Layman

"Obviously, I don't know anything about you and your involvement in stuff."

Clearly not. I'm quite familiar with DC politics and your insinuation otherwise has no bearing at all. I also know that Democrats have endorsed non-Democrats in this town, such as Catania having garnering support form Patterson and Ambrose in years past.

"Anyway, you forget that Jim Graham needs a job starting in Jan. 2015. Endorsing Catania, if he doesn't win, scotches many potential job chances."

Again, Graham was not obliged to endorse Bowser, he chose to. For whatever reason that may have been is just your OPINION, regardless of your attempts to pass it off as fact.

by Brett M in David Catania on Metro, economic development, streetcars, affordable housing, bike lanes, building heights, and more on Oct 24, 2014 4:22 pm • linkreport

For those that want to know where the Eisenhower Valley is ... http://eisenhowerpartnership.wildapricot.org/Resources/Documents/eisenhower-print-map.pdf

by Thad in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 4:12 pm • linkreport

"Once we have a driver who is behaving dangerously and illegally, the ability of a cyclist to predict their future behavior disappears."

That's not true. If I see a driver going at 90 mph, they are simultaneously dangerous, lawbreaking and predictable. Similarly, a driver squeezing out a cyclist can be expected to stay close or even close the gap. I've not said Evan goes out looking for confrontation. I would say that he seizes on provocations and refuses to back down. That's assuming risk and gives an insurance company a plausible basis for denying a claim, which means that any injury of property damage he sustains in asserting his rights might not be compensated.

by Crickey7 in Breakfast links: Vote early on Oct 24, 2014 4:11 pm • linkreport

Actually, the neighborhood next to the Eisenhower Ave station does have a name, it is called the Carlyle Area/District, with the Eisenhower Valley extending westward toward the Van Dorn Metro station. Even the Visitor's Bureau knows this - http://www.visitalexandriava.com/about-alexandria/neighborhoods/carlyle-eisenhower/

by Thad in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 4:09 pm • linkreport

@Richard

"investing the paltry sum that DC is considering for even the entire 37 mile street car system would not be enough to create even 1 new Metrorail line."

"Paltry" is highly subjective. The new plan calls for $800 million for 8 miles, which is much more realistic than the original estimates, but likely to be underestimated like the costs for the H St line. And when you factor in inflation, the need to replace the H St bridge, and general incompetence, I'm willing to bet this will easily exceed the budget.

While subways are obviously more expensive, the clear advantages of removing travelers from the roads, ability to bypass intersections and mixed traffic, and ability to travel at such high speeds vastly outweigh any advantages that a mixed-use streetcar or even one with dedicated lanes on busy thoroughfares like K St may have.

The only light rail I would support would run on existing right-of-way train tracks or alongside the freeway, but none of our elected officials has the vision to make this possible (and we see what happened to the train track portion of the Anacostia line).

by Brett M in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 4:07 pm • linkreport

5 is the Building Museum, looking north at the museum from the Law Enforcement Memorial.

7 is looking north along 7th St SW, from the Amtrak bridge over 7th.

by Moose in Name these spots in the Flickr pool on Oct 24, 2014 4:06 pm • linkreport

#2 is 14th & T looking north with the new Matchbox Pizza on the right.

#6 is 10th & U looking north along the side of Garnett-Patterson Middle School.

by crin in Name these spots in the Flickr pool on Oct 24, 2014 3:52 pm • linkreport

The Rt. 606 stop is too far from either Brambleton or Sterling and therefore needs it's own identity. In coming up with a name, I wasn't afraid to embellish.
Some examples I chose:

-Lyndora Park (a nearby park)
-Lyndora (shortened)
-Horsepen Village (from the nearby Horsepen Pond. If anything is built around this pond as a gathering space, that's a bonus)
-Greenway City (for the Toll Rd., and open land on both sides)
-Gateway City
-Old Ox Heights (not sure if this is high, even or low ground, but an adjustment like "Valley" or "Plains" can be added)
-Northwoods (a nearby development)
-Mercure Post (Mercure is a nearby business park)

For the Rt. 772 station, I chose:

-Ryan (just to the north)
-Moorefield Station (a development to the west)

Ashburn should be reserved for another station to the north of Claiborne Parkway-closest to the town.

by David B. in What would you call Loudoun's Metro stations? on Oct 24, 2014 3:48 pm • linkreport

First photo (red, yellow, green rowhouses), the red rowhouse is 1312 Massachusetts Avenue SE near Lincoln Park on Capitol Hill.

by crin in Name these spots in the Flickr pool on Oct 24, 2014 3:47 pm • linkreport

@jeffB and Kit,

Isn't the Evan Wilder case an example of a problem in search of a solution? Being a "self-styled cycling vigilante" (whatever that means) doesn't change the facts of the case.

A lot of this Wilder criticism ("militant cyclist", Vigilante, crusader etc...) sounds like the "She's very promiscuous and dresses provocatively, therefore what happened to her is not rape" kind of stuff that women have to deal with.

@Crikey7

Once we have a driver who is behaving dangerously and illegally, the ability of a cyclist to predict their future behavior disappears. They're unpredictable, so braking might be as likely to result in a crash as not braking.

Re:Women cycling

A recent report made the case that one reason that women bike less is that they're more

likely to be responsible for transporting kids around. Now, you can move kids by bike for sure, but it does add a layer of complexity to it all.

by David C in Breakfast links: Vote early on Oct 24, 2014 3:47 pm • linkreport

@alurin

I agree transit stations should be named after locations (actually, I'd say "places") not people. But, neighborhoods could be named after people and where the neighborhood has no commonly used name, the transit station name could be used to create one. For example, changing the name of the NY Ave metro station to NoMa helped create a commonly used neighborhood name. Similarly, changing the Eisenhower Ave station name to Eisenhower could have the same affect. Changing the McPherson Square station to McPherson could create an area that's referred to by that name similar to how Farragut is often referred to as a place.

@Mike B

And, I differ with you. I still prefer Union Station to Union even though there's a subway stop in Toronto called Union.

by Falls Church in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 3:37 pm • linkreport

While I would really like to see more Metrorail, a lot more metro rail, investing the paltry sum that DC is considering for even the entire 37 mile street car system would not be enough to create even 1 new Metrorail line.

$3.1B would actually buy a lot of Metrorail service within DC. Part of the cost would also be paid by federal dollars and the other jurisdictions through which the fictitious line(s) would travel.

Although I agree it's a bit of a false choice. I'd rather see $3.1B spent on an excellent light rail system rather than an extension of Metro. But I'd rather not see $3.1B spent on a system modeled after the H St line.

by Scoot in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 3:33 pm • linkreport

I'm pretty sure that Cloverleaf Industries has been pulling the strings, behind the scenes, to kill the streetcar.

by The Truth™ in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 3:31 pm • linkreport

@Mark: As I understand it, the rationale behind the streetcar project is that Metro will not address many of the city's transportation issues because Metro is responsible to VA and MD, as well as DC. Projects which only serve to help DC residents get around their city are not high priority for Metro. Hence the Circulator buses, hence the streetcar network, both of which are funded out of the DC budget, not the Metro budget.
Furthermore, the city needs a diverse ecosystem of transit options at different carrying capacities and price points. Metrorail is great, but heavy rail is not a great investment for every route.
So just saying, hey, we should be spending this money on Metro instead of a streetcar is wrong.

by alurin in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 3:08 pm • linkreport

@massysett

+1!

by august4 in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 2:44 pm • linkreport

Our investment should be in Metrorail.

While I would really like to see more Metrorail, a lot more metro rail, investing the paltry sum that DC is considering for even the entire 37 mile street car system would not be enough to create even 1 new Metrorail line.

It's like telling a teenager he shouldn't spend his allowance to buy a bike, because cars are better at everything. The costs are just too different, and DC transit doesn't have the budget to consider a downtown tunnel and cavernous underground stations alone.

by Richard in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 2:41 pm • linkreport

I haven't seen the details, but in principle, I'm happy that suburban counties and municipalities are including some bike lanes in these fast roads. Hopefully it will make all road users happier.

by Geof Gee in New bike lanes will close a big trail gap in Burke on Oct 24, 2014 2:28 pm • linkreport

Yes the trams in sf are so worthless that in the latest apta report they carried more riders than any other light rail/streetcar system in the country. 223k daily riders. What a travesty!

That is DC's future. Not the anti vision of zero ridership and no extensions.

by h st ll in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 2:26 pm • linkreport

Yeah. People are split 50/50 on something most have never seen working. Very weird. Yet the people who have been around the world and have seen transit working, are 100/0 in favor. Because they know it works elsewhere, so it can work here.

I've taken streetcars in a number of other cities in the world (Jerusalem, Istanbul, San Francisco, New Orleans, Amsterdam, Strasbourg and others) and I remain unconvinced that the H St line will significantly ease public transit woes in the neighborhood.

by Scoot in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 2:25 pm • linkreport

@Mike B: That's ambiguous evidence, since the first line of the article reads "Union Station is a subway station on the Yonge–University–Spadina line in Toronto, Canada."

by alurin in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 2:15 pm • linkreport

As a mass transit advocate and long-time transit rider, I simply don't get the streetcar hype. I live in San Francisco where we have our lumbering streetcar lines sharing traffic with other vehicles and...the...trains...crawl. Unless there's a separated ROW then forget about it. DC doesn't need streetcars. It needs a separated blue line, it needs Metro to run under Columbia Pike, it needs better connections to existing transit (ped tunnels between Farraguts N and W, for example), etc.

I recently rode the light rail in Charlotte...dedicated ROW. The right way to do it.

by Mark in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 2:15 pm • linkreport

I suspect that the residents of 1333 M St will mostly use cars to get everywhere, due to the isolated location. Otherwise you'd have to walk for a while past an office park to get anywhere (of course that would change completely if the grid gets extended). It will be interesting to see if lower 8th Street ever gets more developed-- I think the fate of the blue castle will determine that.

by Navy contractor in The 11th Street Bridge Park gets a brilliant design. Will it succeed? on Oct 24, 2014 2:11 pm • linkreport

When I see the poor planning and execution from DDOT and observe the H St traffic result, it boggles the mind that some are proposing a street car for Wisconsin Avenue. It is likely that it would run in traffic -- it would have to below Glover Park because the road is too narrow for dedicated lanes.

"Too narrow for dedicated lanes" is not a law of physics - it is a preference being willfully chosen by people who would rather see that area of the city be largely auto-dependent. Some of us, by contrast, would love to see dedicated transit-only lanes on Wisconsin all the way down through Georgetown. No need to cling to a few dozen street parking spaces.

by Dizzy in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 2:06 pm • linkreport

@Falls Church
I beg to differ. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_(TTC)

by Mike B in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 2:04 pm • linkreport

When I see the poor planning and execution from DDOT and observe the H St traffic result, it boggles the mind that some are proposing a street car for Wisconsin Avenue. It is likely that it would run in traffic -- it would have to below Glover Park because the road is too narrow for dedicated lanes. If it runs in traffic, the result would be an H St mess. If lanes are dedicated at Glover and above, a traffic sewer becomes a traffic cesspool, as the carrying capacity of a major arterial is reduced significanlty. This would lead to addtional gridlock and/or the inappropriate diversion of signifiant commuter traffic on to smaller streets that are not equipped to handle such flow. Either way, a Wisconsin streetcar would be a mess.

by Alf in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 1:56 pm • linkreport

No one is going to ride metro to or from Loudoun County and extending the train all the way out there is going to dilute the number of trains closer in to DC. Metro should definitely stop at Dulles and set up express buses from Loudoun to Dulles for the few people out there that are going to catch metro.

by Mike in What would you call Loudoun's Metro stations? on Oct 24, 2014 1:55 pm • linkreport

... you really need to read some of the "Growth Machine" or "Urban Regime" work to get a sense of the local political and economic elites and how they interact, think, do, etc. Obviously, I don't know anything about you and your involvement in stuff.

Briefly I considered running for the W4 seat, figuring that Bowser will win. So I wrote up a platform outline, and started talking with people who typically run campaigns.

Those interactions reminded me of why I hate "politics" and because my significant other was not supportive of the idea either, I ended up ceasing those efforts. I just didn't want to have to deal with the people who run campaigns, are into politics and not governance, with extremely facile ideas, etc.

BUT, basically, all the kinds of stuff you read about "politics" and "campaigns" is true.

Anyway, you forget that Jim Graham needs a job starting in Jan. 2015. Endorsing Catania, if he doesn't win, scotches many potential job chances.

When I worked briefly in Balt. County, two of the people not re-elected in 2010 were picked up by the new County Exec. (who had been a Councilman). One runs an agency (so he fell up, because Councilmembers in Balt. County are part time and make about $60,000). The other guy is now a lobbyist for the executive branch with the state.

The people who are really engaged in politics tend to be pretty calculating.

by Richard Layman in David Catania on Metro, economic development, streetcars, affordable housing, bike lanes, building heights, and more on Oct 24, 2014 1:38 pm • linkreport

@Jasper

"Yeah, absurd to think that packing people closer together can end congestion. Insane idea."

Actually, I think it's absurd to assume that a non-versatile streetcar would move through congestion any better, as you seemed to have suggested. There are much more cost-effective ways to add capacity to roads, although I do not think our roads need any more vehicles, including buses or streetcars. Our investment should be in Metrorail.

@Scoot

"We can talk about the past all you want but the real issue is the streetcar's future."

The purpose for bringing up the past was in response to Dizzy's question why Alpert is "unwilling to concede that all of this opacity and lack of traction were features, rather than bugs. " It's likely because he has long supported a flawed concept, and a poorly planned one at that.

This explains the several years of delays and cost overruns, and further, the failure of it to solve any of our transportation woes.

by Brett M in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 1:36 pm • linkreport

Transit station should be named for locations, not people. That helps make the system legible and easier to navigate. Otherwise you end up like Soviet transit systems, where you would have to travel to "14th Party Congress Station".

by alurin in Breakfast links: Shorter streetcar (for now) on Oct 24, 2014 1:23 pm • linkreport

Yeah. People are split 50/50 on something most have never seen working. Very weird. Yet the people who have been around the world and have seen transit working, are 100/0 in favor. Because they know it works elsewhere, so it can work here.

Ehh... I took the tram in Prague almost every day for months. Ir worked pretty well... there. DC is not Prague. Since we didn't get dedicated lanes, I would've preferred that all that money have been spent on Metro improvements. Alternatively, rather than make H Street the test case, I would've doubled down on the Anacostia segment, where the infrastructure could have a much more development-spurring effect and also isn't on a primary commuter route into the city.

I'm not really a streetcar supporter or opponent - it can be a useful mode, but I don't think there's all that many places in America where it would be worth it, compared to other modes.

by Dizzy in No, DC is not abandoning plans for most streetcar lines on Oct 24, 2014 1:22 pm • linkreport

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