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But that's all because of the Metro lines. The transportation/land use plans would never have occurred without Metro. The only reason Arlington has those Metro lines is geography.

Except the original plans were to run in the median of 66 all the way to the river. Instead Arlington lobbied to have it run underneath Wilson so they could build intensely right on top of the line. That wasn't an accident of geography it was very much intentional.

Fairfax simply doesn't have the geography and compact size to do what Arlington did.

Sure but its not like Fairfax couldn't have been smarter about its own transportation and land use plans. Instead they just assumed that everyone will drive everywhere. They were correct but it turns out that makes traffic very bad.

But Fairfax isn't alone in this. This is the case across much of the country.

The number of people who will bike from Fairfax into Arlington/DC is inconsequential in number. It won't provide any relief to I-66. It might be fun for some recreationalists on the weekend and maybe a few diehard commuters, but otherwise it does nothing.

No one has really argued that it would. It would help local communities that are going to have to deal with an even wider highway and actually provide some non-driving connections in places that have little to none.

But that hasn't stopped tolling opponents from latching onto this one small part of the overall project and lying about what is actually proposed.

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:50 pm • linkreport

"The number of people who will bike from Fairfax into Arlington/DC is inconsequential in number. It won't provide any relief to I-66. It might be fun for some recreationalists on the weekend and maybe a few diehard commuters, but otherwise it does nothing."

There are already a significant number of bike commuters on the W&OD trail, and it seems like if there were a good facility parallel to I66 that would also get transportation use. It might not be a massive amount, but it will not be all that expensive (and note, it would not only be for people riding to Arlington, but within Fairfax, for example to Dunn Loring, and to the Orange Line metro stations) most of the alternatives money will go for transit.

by CrossingBrooklynFerry in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:45 pm • linkreport

ETA: "The Berg"

by Kristen in Modern Washingtonians have a mandate to remember black Georgetown on Feb 10, 2016 4:42 pm • linkreport

". One talks about the Hump, a historically black neighborhood. "

It was "Tthe Berg", not "the Hump".

by Kristen in Modern Washingtonians have a mandate to remember black Georgetown on Feb 10, 2016 4:41 pm • linkreport

Arlington does have some geographic luck but the reason traffic has fallen on its surface streets was tying its transportation and land use plans together so that the most dense areas are also the easiest places to get around without a car.

But that's all because of the Metro lines. The transportation/land use plans would never have occurred without Metro. The only reason Arlington has those Metro lines is geography.

Fairfax is just now trying to do the same but has a lot less to work with.

Fairfax simply doesn't have the geography and compact size to do what Arlington did.

So yeah, doing more of those things helps people get to where they're going faster.

The number of people who will bike from Fairfax into Arlington/DC is inconsequential in number. It won't provide any relief to I-66. It might be fun for some recreationalists on the weekend and maybe a few diehard commuters, but otherwise it does nothing.

by ArlingtonFlyer in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:38 pm • linkreport

What was that again about the definition of insanity?

So what would your preferred alternative be? Something that looks like this?

by JES in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:26 pm • linkreport

Just because someone did it doesn't make it logical.

Huh?

Look at all the examples I cited: airports, parks, water supply. There's a very clear logic for why those systems required property acquisition outside of the city limits.

This is true in DC as well, when the Federal Government was acting as the local government, they purchased land to build an airport outside of the District. Why? because they needed a lot of flat, available land. Logical.

They (via the Army Corps of Engineers) built DC's water infrastructure, extending well into today's suburbs. Why? Because that's where the water sources were. Logical.

Like I said, I don't know that homeless services has the same case - a more likely solution is regional cooperation on social services like this, including facilities spread across the region so that those in need don't just flock to the central jurisdiction.

But the idea that any city's interests and ability to act ends at their city limits is certainly illogical.

by Alex B. in Breakfast links: More Shelters, fewer riders on Feb 10, 2016 4:19 pm • linkreport

As if building a multi-billion dollar rail transit line,

Which carries more people than 66 does in an hour.

restricting a road to carpoolers during rush hours,
Which are the times when 66 is actually flowing the smoothest.

and lining the road with a bike trail

It already does in Arlington at least and the trail is very busy year round. Extending that seems sensible.

So yeah, doing more of those things helps people get to where they're going faster.

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:11 pm • linkreport

"The entire historical point of the suburbs was (and is) to decouple the wealth of the middle-class from the problems of the city."

The historical point of the City of Alexandria was to ship tobacco. It had both poor and affluent people. Sometime around 1920 the affluent moved out of the historic city ("Old Town") into suburban neighborhoods, which however were within the City (Rosemont, Beverly Hills, etc) A relatively lightly developed area, West Alexandria, was annexed to the City from Fairfax County, and was populated, IIUC, by both middle class people from the older parts of Alexandria, and people coming from DC. Like the affluent suburban parts of East Alexandria, they supported the City which governed (not sure they provided much in the way of social services back then) the poor african americans of Old Town. Since that time West Alexandria has become heavily African American (and also African - and also hispanic) while Old Town has become white and very affluent. The City government is now quite supportive of social services, and both affluent people in the more affluent suburban parts of Alexandria, and those in the gentrified WUP of Old Town, help to pay for them.

I am not sure how any of this has anything to do with the issues of DC. "And obviously we want to make sure we build in places like Montgomery County and Fairfax in the interest of sharing the burden." Ah, you are no longer discussing Alexandria. Good. I am not following FFX as closely, and know very little about policy on homelessness in MoCo. I will let others chime in.

by CrossingBrooklynFerry in Breakfast links: More Shelters, fewer riders on Feb 10, 2016 4:07 pm • linkreport

"It's way past time to actually try something different (which isn't really happening here since 66 is still being widened)."
---
As if building a multi-billion dollar rail transit line, restricting a road to carpoolers during rush hours, and lining the road with a bike trail - in addition to sustantialy reducing the road's planned footprint - wasn't already "trying something different".

We've been "trying something different" on I-66 for over a quarter-century. It's not working.

What was that again about the definition of insanity?

by August4 in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:07 pm • linkreport

@Hadur: you do, but 66 between the Beltway and the DTR isn't the problem...in no small part because over half the traffic on 66 east of Nutley exits onto the Beltway.

As for this compromise plan, call me guardedly optimistic. The concerns of some about congestion in 3-5 years should be mitigated by the fact that peak period tolls will remain. While I would have liked to see the tolling first and then evaluate to see if the widening's necessary, I'll accept this if it moves the plan forward.

That said, I would have liked to see the Governor grow a pair instead of appeasing what amounts to a small handful of legislators and their constituents who grew their own traffic problems by moving out there but blocking efforts to mitigate the commute. Had the Governor stood firm and vetoed any potential anti-tolling plan, I doubt the General Assembly would have had the votes to override the veto.

by Froggie in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:06 pm • linkreport

@oboe

What makes you think DC's homeless want to move to a homeless shelter in the burbs? If they wanted to, what's stopping them now?

At any rate, DC already houses some homeless people in the burbs in hotels.

by Falls Church in Breakfast links: More Shelters, fewer riders on Feb 10, 2016 4:06 pm • linkreport

stop trying to make 'Capitol Riverfront' happen. it's not going to happen.

by jkc in How the Navy, baseball, and government planners made Capitol Riverfront one of DC's hottest neighborhoods on Feb 10, 2016 4:05 pm • linkreport

The ONLY reason Arlington saw a shift to less traffic was because of pure geographic luck of being at the entry point to DC and thus where multiple metro lines were forced through. If it wasn't for that location, Arlington would be no different than any other suburb.

Arlington does have some geographic luck but the reason traffic has fallen on its surface streets was tying its transportation and land use plans together so that the most dense areas are also the easiest places to get around without a car.

Not just metro, but the Art bus. The now-canceled streetcar plans, its investment in bicycle infrastructure.

That's why traffic is lower on almost all of the surface streets today than 30 years ago despite a huge population spike.

Fairfax is just now trying to do the same but has a lot less to work with.

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:04 pm • linkreport

Three cheers for compromise! Anyone capable of counting votes understood that Delegate LeMunyon's bill to ban tolling on 66 inside the beltway would have sailed through and been veto-proof, thereby killing any real chance of easing travel in this bedeviled corridor. In the end, the choice for Arlington was: Receive no toll funding for multi-modal purposes or receive toll funding for said purposes in exchange for immediate widening. Since widening would likely happen anyway, they held their noses and accepted it now in exchange for the deal. Outer locales held their noses to accept the toll, knowing a significant portion of the resulting toll revenue paid by their constituents will go to purposes of remote value to those voters. Half a loaf is better than no loaf at all. Congratulations to the governor and legislators for showing gridlock isn't inevitable, whether in legislative or transportation arenas. May their federal counterparts take note.

by Road to Damascus in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:04 pm • linkreport

As Alex wrote above, it makes far more sense to toll first and then adjust accordingly. But given the rhetoric I've read from Fairfax and Loudoun County regarding congestion tolls, I suspect that it's the only way forward.

by Geof Gee in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:01 pm • linkreport

Arlington will certainly get more traffic. That's despite them doing way more than everyone else in the region to actually reduce traffic (and be successful at it).

The ONLY reason Arlington saw a shift to less traffic was because of pure geographic luck of being at the entry point to DC and thus where multiple metro lines were forced through. If it wasn't for that location, Arlington would be no different than any other suburb.

That option is now off the table for NoVa though. I suspect that this widening will simply shift the congestion to either further east on I-66 where the road isn't widened and/or surface streets in Ballston which aren't being widened.

Not really because the bottleneck is caused by poor design more than the need for more capacity. The reality is that adding this third lane isn't really adding any capacity, it's really just extending the merge lane, so that traffic has more space to merge. That's all it is.

And no matter how defensible that argument is, it still would be better to toll the road first and then re-evaluate based on how the toll performs in managing demand.

But we already know the answer. It wasn't going to work long-term. VDOT's own modeling showed there would only be minimal short-term relief with the tolling only plan.

by ArlingtonFlyer in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 4:00 pm • linkreport

Right! Why can't the lights be phased in after the lane has already been established?

A bus-only lane will surely start to have immediate benefits, even without priority lights, no?

by The Truth™ in Breakfast links: More Shelters, fewer riders on Feb 10, 2016 3:55 pm • linkreport

You know how to really speed up a lane for bus priority? Quit the frills and paint new markings, & voila! Bus lane. in less than 4 years.

by asffa in Breakfast links: More Shelters, fewer riders on Feb 10, 2016 3:52 pm • linkreport

The problem was that election resources were diverted to "safe" seats and could not be focused on that suburban Richmond seat or other targeted seats.

Except democrats won in Northern Virginia.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/mcauliffes-hopes-for-senate-majority-dashed/2015/11/03/95400f9c-826a-11e5-8ba6-cec48b74b2a7_story.html

The republicans who are still here criticize 66 but even then the big issues were gun control and abortion clinics.

It sounds convenient to attack "bike paths" for the project but that doesn't make it true.

People do have a hard time commuting on 66. It's not because of anything except that we added a lot of people without doing anything in regards to transportation except widen roads for the most part. It's way past time to actually try something different (which isn't really happening here since 66 is still being widened).

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:50 pm • linkreport

"Just because someone did it doesn't make it logical."

Not sure what you mean by "not logical".

The entire historical point of the suburbs was (and is) to decouple the wealth of the middle-class from the problems of the city. Implementing some sort of mechanism to export the burden a bit seems like a no-brainer. Certainly controversial--particularly among the municipalities that benefit from the status quo. But not "illogical".

I think DC should fund social services in the suburbs, and maybe add Metro subsidies for transit-centric locations, and maybe shuttle buses for those that are not close to transportation. And obviously we want to make sure we build in places like Montgomery County and Fairfax in the interest of sharing the burden.

Maybe in the distant future, wealthy suburbs would be subsidizing housing in the city.

by oboe in Breakfast links: More Shelters, fewer riders on Feb 10, 2016 3:47 pm • linkreport

@drumz

The problem was that election resources were diverted to "safe" seats and could not be focused on that suburban Richmond seat or other targeted seats.

by Paul J. Meissner in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:43 pm • linkreport

Excellent article.

Are there any historical markers in Georgetown that touch on these issues?

In Parker Gray next to Old Town Alexandria, the city erected two panels at the intersection of North Alfred and Montgomery. One talks about the Hump, a historically black neighborhood. The other covers the James Bland Homes that were torn down. It touches on the residents fighting to receive fair compensation.

by Jay in Modern Washingtonians have a mandate to remember black Georgetown on Feb 10, 2016 3:43 pm • linkreport

we'll need a more pertinent example like building an school or a county facility outside of the jurisdiction.

Until a recent land swap, Falls Church City's high school was located in Fairfax County.

by Falls Church in Breakfast links: More Shelters, fewer riders on Feb 10, 2016 3:41 pm • linkreport

River Cross My Heart. Apparently the author is a DC native too.

by BTA in Modern Washingtonians have a mandate to remember black Georgetown on Feb 10, 2016 3:36 pm • linkreport

Aren't the new bus lines and the Rte 50 MUT still in the plan?

by CrossingBrooklynFerry in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:26 pm • linkreport

On a policy note, tolling Fairfax drivers to pay for Arlington bus lanes and bike paths

This isn't true. The "bike paths" in question would have run almost wholly in Fairfax and Prince William counties as the Custis Path is extended out from Falls Church.

Same with buses. Many would run through and terminate in Arlington but they'd be using the HOT Lanes that are being built between Fairfax and Prince William.

The senate race that was crucial to Va democrats was outside the Richmond area. Not in Northern Virginia.

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:21 pm • linkreport

I'm not as opposed to widening I-66 as the typical GGWer, but if you widen only outside the Beltway, don't you just create additional traffic at the point where the highway narrows?

by Hadur in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:19 pm • linkreport

Typo: should be "even social classes"

by Paul J. Meissner in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:19 pm • linkreport

You know what they say: elections have consequences.

NoVA has been trending blue for the last 10 to 20 years but this was a real quality of life issue that likely cost the Dems the state senate.

On a policy note, tolling Fairfax drivers to pay for Arlington bus lanes and bike paths was such a terrible, terrible idea, one that pitted localities and ecen social classes against each other and did nothing to solve congestion.

by Paul J. Meissner in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:18 pm • linkreport

Great point. I read a great novel with this setting but for the life of me I can't remember the name. I love comparing my current knowledge of the city to history from 100 years ago (etc).

by BTA in Modern Washingtonians have a mandate to remember black Georgetown on Feb 10, 2016 3:18 pm • linkreport

Looking forward to your write up on Caucasian Anacostia

by History in Modern Washingtonians have a mandate to remember black Georgetown on Feb 10, 2016 3:03 pm • linkreport

"And congestion also has a financial cost to commuters, non-commuters and businesses."

Yes. So does air pollution. And increased demand on private and public entities for providing more parking spaces in lots and garages. And increased road accidents and death from inducing people who would have ridden transit or biked or walked to drive instead. And increased demand for the extension of urban services/infrastructure (and their associated capital and maintenance costs) to what is now exurban farmland and forests, because suddenly now driving from those locations to downtown is slightly easier.

The point is, the state just decided to not even bother trying to quantify whether the abatement of congestion was worth $140M + all the costs of not abating it. They simply said "widen, baby, widen" and moved forward with their ideological goal of maximizing car use at the expense of everything else.

"Any relief saves us money." So if we spent $140 billion to widen all roads everywhere, we'd save 1000x the $140 million being spent here on I-66? Relief doesn't always save more money than the relief cost in the first place. You have to study a particular relief method (and its alternatives) against the costs of providing that relief... but hey, why study something when you can just go with your gut?

by Dave in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 3:00 pm • linkreport

Kevins - "Dave, as long as Northern Virginia's population is growing fast, it's only reasonable to assume congestion will increase long term."

You're correct... if and only if you assume that there's nothing that can be done to shift newcomers' mode choice at all. However, lots of existing places have managed to add population and still not widen roads at all... by pursuing investment in other modes.

That option is now off the table for NoVa though. I suspect that this widening will simply shift the congestion to either further east on I-66 where the road isn't widened and/or surface streets in Ballston which aren't being widened.

How shifting the congestion from I-66 west of Ballston to these other 2 locations is worth $140M (and the forgoing of whatever that $140M would have bought elsewhere in the state's budget) is beyond me. But hey, I'm sure that the I-66 drivers will be thankful... again, until approx 3-5 years from now when they start clamoring for wider I-66 to DC and/or wider streets in Ballston.

by Dave in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:51 pm • linkreport

"Most importantly, the analysis seems to rest on the assumption that developers will ignore changes in rent or sales prices when deciding how to proceed with their current or future projects. Yet, DC and even DC with the nearby communities that might be close substitutes are part of a larger real estate development market. If there is a temporary “glut,” and rents and sales prices were falling in DC, “smart builders will mothball their projects until the market recovers,” as noted by Paul J. Meissner yesterday."

Except the shortage was severe enough, that the prices were high enough, that prices can fall and still leave much new development profitable. Though there are a few locations where production of new units may have slowed due to lower prices, the volume of production remains high. This is due to the diversity of the market with both demand and cost of construction varying over location.

by CrossingBrooklynFerry in DC added record housing in 2015. That's slowing down price increases. on Feb 10, 2016 2:38 pm • linkreport

Mark, NoVA's congestion is worse than Atlanta's.

by Kevins in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:35 pm • linkreport

Dave, as long as Northern Virginia's population is growing fast, it's only reasonable to assume congestion will increase long term. Adding highway capacity still makes congestion better than it would be without it.

And congestion also has a financial cost to commuters, non-commuters and businesses. Any relief saves us money.

by Kevins in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:33 pm • linkreport

NoVA is becoming like Atlanta with its sprawl and traffic. Long live the south!

by Mark in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:30 pm • linkreport

Cheap housing is old housing. New housing is luxury in a growing city. It is when the new housing ages that supply of affordable housing increases. If we slow down development it stalls the natural depreciation of structures. Slow it enough and land prices counteract the depreciation and housing units grow in value instead of being replaced by new supply. This hollows out the middle and incentivizes the construction of only luxury units.

If rents are stalling at the top and the construction of new units outpaces growth then you will see affordable housing eventually.

The supply and demand crowd may be right, but the lag involved is on a multi-decade level. The cross elasticities exist but they take a long time to effect the market from top to bottom.

There are an unending supply of micro studies that confirm the supply and demand matter, they also suggest that any benefits of increase supply take a long time to propagate through the value chain.

The sides of this argument are talking past each other. The short term effects of increasing supply are often overstated by many. However, the rejection of supply and demand is just as ridiculous.

People need to come up with non-market solutions to mitigate harms in the short-term while increased building continues so as to displace the non-market solutions eventually.

In the end land is the only non-depreciating asset. Unless we let land use by come more efficient and dense then there is no hope for affordable housing long-term unless there is a sudden hit to economic and population growth.

by Errorreport in DC added record housing in 2015. That's slowing down price increases. on Feb 10, 2016 2:24 pm • linkreport

I think some of you are underrating the importance of this compromise securing any kind of tolling on I-66 at all.

Really the need for a compromise comes from a few delegates who apparently didn't know what they were voting on a couple of years ago threatening to push through a bill that would have erased everything that had been worked on up until now. Now they just get to erase a few things. Even though that's what they voted on before.

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:11 pm • linkreport

"The widening will also require a thorough environmental review..." - interesting. Getting a categorical exclusion from FHWA for this should be harder than it will be.

by darren in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:10 pm • linkreport

I think some of you are underrating the importance of this compromise securing any kind of tolling on I-66 at all.

No doubt, this is an important political compromise.

However, that shouldn't prevent us from pointing out that an entirely political decision isn't actually based on any fact.

The previous plan would've provided some great evidence for the ability to manage congestion with tolls and remove the percieved need to widen roads.

So, I would agree that this is a 'common sense' political compromise. But the idea that this is a 'common sense' transportation compromise isn't supported by anything.

An extra lane in this stretch is the most obviously defensible widening opportunity in the corridor, especially since it's badly congested at times that weren't even proposed to be tolled.

And no matter how defensible that argument is, it still would be better to toll the road first and then re-evaluate based on how the toll performs in managing demand.

by Alex B. in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:07 pm • linkreport

I think some of you are underrating the importance of this compromise securing any kind of tolling on I-66 at all. I agree that tolling in one direction during peak hours is insufficient to solve the congestion issues in this corridor. But you know what will get us a lot closer to true congestion pricing? Tolling at all. Once the infrastructure, signage, and expectation of tolls are in place, expanding/increasing them will be an easy and viable alternative to reflexive calls for widening.

by Zach in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 2:01 pm • linkreport

While I'm disappointed the agreement includes an accelerated timeline for the widening of I-66, I'm encouraged that aspects of the deal include increased investment in multi-modal transportation solutions that will include expanded bus service, carpooling, and other ways to improve transit options not just on I-66 but throughout the region.

I've been assured by the Governor that the widening of I-66 will be done within the existing right of way and sound barriers will be strengthened to completely mitigate any harm to existing homes or Arlington's quality of life as a result.

by Delegate Patrick Hope in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 1:56 pm • linkreport

Somebody earmark this post for future reference in about 3-5 years, when congestion has resumed/exceeded current levels at Ballston and the state starts talking about widening further east to the district line. That's typically about how long widening "solves" congestion before induced demand eats up the extra capacity.

$140M for 3-5 years of (slightly) faster travel... What a bargain!

by Dave in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 1:56 pm • linkreport

"I know GGW likes to be divisive and pit different groups against each other,"

No.

by CrossingBrooklynFerry in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 1:55 pm • linkreport

And its not 66 itself. Its decades of just letting development build without requisite investments in transportation and then trying to fix problems one at a time which created several bottlenecks along the entire corridor. Adding 100s of thousands of residents with the bare minimums in transit, walkability, and cycling is of course going to create nightmare traffic issues. But instead of adding those things we just widen the roads again.

Yet somehow Arlington is the bad actor because they avoided these problems.

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 1:54 pm • linkreport

I suppose this is fine but it is a shame tolling is not happening in both directions. The only time that 66 actually flows well is during rush hour in the rush hour direction, despite all of the HOV cheaters and hybrid exemptions. To me this means that tolling the other direction will only be accomplished with another lane increase or something else and that is disappointing. But I understand the political difficulties here.

by Abe in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 1:51 pm • linkreport

Arlington will certainly get more traffic. That's despite them doing way more than everyone else in the region to actually reduce traffic (and be successful at it).

Other places are even jealous of what Arlington was able to acheive and blatantly state they want to create a similar environment where they are.

But when push comes to shove they just figure "screw it" and widen the roads anyway.

We had a plan that had some widening but with a lot of stuff to try and prevent people from just clogging the roads again. All the "compromises" have since been to get rid of various things to keep things in check and add more widening.

What's worse is that we know, that just won't work. But facts don't matter when it comes to 66.

by drumz in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 1:50 pm • linkreport

@VJU
Because history has shown throughout the unites states that widening freeways doesn't reduce traffic.
Once Arlington widens the 66, traffic will still be there.

by Brett Young in I-66 widening will happen soon whether it makes sense or not on Feb 10, 2016 1:50 pm • linkreport

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