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As far as money goes, yes the ICC is sucking up alot of resources and the recession isn't helping but it is important to move the Purple Line into the federal funding stream this year.
It is unlikely that the Maryland General Assembly will raise transportation revenues in 2010 (an election year) but activists should prepare for a concerted campaign for 2011 to fund needed transit improvements.
by kreeggo on Jun 18, 2009 9:30 am
I've always admired the 16th and T rowhouse and wondered why nothing was being done to save it. The fire escape is the main source of it's problem, no room for expansion and contraction has resulted in tearing apart the wall it's attached to. As for structural engineers, they're always a bit alarmist, allthough some thing ought to be done asap.
As for Philip Kennicott's article I think the idea that it should be easy to distinguish old buildings from ones that are trying to fit in is a relatively modern one. In the past I think the architect of a 1910's neo-federal rowhouse would have taken it as a compliment if it blended in seamlessly with an 1810’s federal rowhouse next door. This sophistry of buildings needing to be “of their time” is a relic of Modernisms puritanism that should be done away with in architectural schools. After all we teach our kids to conform to rules and manners handed down from generation to generation.
Yeah to the Purple line!!!
by Thayer-D on Jun 18, 2009 9:34 am
by Laurence Aurbach on Jun 18, 2009 9:41 am
as usualy, your comments are excellent.
The moron writer who disgorged that WaPo article is a relic himself. What an abysmally UGLY piece of garbage that "addition" is- my GF and I were cycling by on the new bieway the other day and she stopped to look at it- wondering aloud if it was some kind of "temporary structure" and to her horror- I told her that it was a permenant "addition".
I feel the same way about the "beautification efforts" for the Old Capitol Power Plant on South Capitol Street SE- the ugly metal "bedsprings" that the "architect put up" in an attempt to hide the Brutalist concrete 1970's addition is just as bad as the Burtalism.
None of this kind of building ages well.
The addition to the beautiful old DC City Hall will look really disgusting in 25 years after it ages and rusts out.
This Post writer is a real Jerk with a Capital "J".
by w on Jun 18, 2009 10:15 am
by SG on Jun 18, 2009 10:18 am
Key quotes:
"...The whole mass of the architecture, founded on Greek and Roman models, which we have been in the habit of building for the last three centuries, is utterly devoid of all life, virtue, honorableness, or power of doing good. It is base, unnatural, unfruitful, unenjoyable, and impious."
"...An architecture invented, as it seems, to make plagiarists of its architects" - "an architecture in which intellect is idle, invention impossible" - "the first thing we have to do is cast it out, and shake the dust of it from our feet for ever."
"...Exactly in the degree in which Greek and Roman architecture is lifeless, unprofitable, and unchristian, in that same degree our own Modern architecture of light and glass is animated, serviceable, and faithful."
Only a Modernist!
by David Ramos on Jun 18, 2009 10:25 am
by ah on Jun 18, 2009 10:31 am
by BeyondDC on Jun 18, 2009 10:53 am
by Lance on Jun 18, 2009 11:33 am
Well, sorta. It has a precedent in 18th-Century Neoclassicism and its grandchild, the Beaux-arts. The Neoclassicists were brutally critical of Baroque and Gothic architecture; Rococo architects got trashed as monarchists, weak-minded fools, sensualists, and even as gays. Neoclassicists coined the term Gothic to assault what they saw as a barbaric, unsophisticated style. Likewise, they invented the concept of classicism as we know it, saying there were certain forms that were perfect. In the process, they disavowed all other styles and cultures. They believed that their style was more than a style, so every building produced in their architecture would be original, even if it was a literal copy of an inherited building. There was a way, they found it, and the issue was so settled, that it was a law of nature. Sound familiar? Modernist ideology and Neoclassicism have the same roots in Cartesian philosophy.
This sophistry of buildings needing to be “of their time”... etc.
In the 1930s, architects wanted to build buildings “for our time,” and only after the 60s do they start saying “of our time.” Interesting linguistic shift.
Oh yeah, and that box is fugly even without the context and would fit in quite well with the Walgreens.
by цarьchitect on Jun 18, 2009 11:53 am
Where I'll be working (thanks for the mention, BTW) the Purple Line wouldn't really enter into my commute, and I wouldn't be able to afford tolls on the ICC (gotta think about those student loans), but I could've taken 28 to work. And I'll be doing that anyway, except it'll just be more unpleasant. Thanks, Bob Ehrlich.
by dan reed on Jun 18, 2009 12:02 pm
You make a very cogent point about cartesian absolutism or something of the sort, except that the Modernists disavowed any connection to previous architecture (see Gropious quotes above). The Neo-classisists, Palladians, Ruskinian Gothicists (etc.) on the other hand at least did not disavow learning from the past entirely by the simple fact that they all referenced the past in their own way. That's a critical difference, especially in the light of the fact that modernism today is as historicist as any suburban Georgian manse. If we'd focus on problem solving rather that philosophical treatises of zeitgeist, we would not only be helping young architects actually learn their trade, but we might get a more beautiful and memorable built environment.
BTW, I think in the 1980's architects started saying "yo, what time is it", but I'm no linguist, just an architect.
by Thayer-D on Jun 18, 2009 1:17 pm
by tom veil on Jun 18, 2009 1:19 pm
by MichaelA on Jun 18, 2009 1:40 pm
Tsarchitect: Interesting tidbit about Neoclassicists coining the term Gothic. What was Gothic called before then?
by BeyondDC on Jun 18, 2009 2:11 pm
by Thayer-D on Jun 18, 2009 2:21 pm
by kreeggo on Jun 18, 2009 3:02 pm
the first thing we have to do is cast it out, and shake the dust of it from our feet for ever
I'm sorry; I thought that the quote would be familiar enough that people would recognize it, after a little cognitive disconnect. It's not Walter Gropius - it's Ruskin in The Stones of Venice, only speaking about the Gothic.
Ideology, however much hot air it produces, seems to be inseparable from design and thinking about design. Andrés Duany wrote something about how he, a Postmodernist architect, set aside matters of style in the interest of fighting the more important battle - one about land use. And yet those cultural concerns seem to be ingrained in the very DNA of building.
by David Ramos on Jun 18, 2009 6:12 pm
I've seen a few projects, built or unbuilt, but all for Federal agencies, in which someone added a lobby/security box onto an existing structure. Seems like the US government really really likes having defined spaces for security screening. Maybe it's a GSA recommendation talking. I believe it may have something to do with keeping unscreened people away, in the interest of blast protection, while also not forcing those unscreened plebeians to wait in the rain.
by David Ramos on Jun 18, 2009 6:16 pm
The ideal would've been to widen 28/198, which parallels the ICC between 270 and 95, and build the Purple Line. Instead, we'll get the ICC.
Where I'll be working (thanks for the mention, BTW) the Purple Line wouldn't really enter into my commute, and I wouldn't be able to afford tolls on the ICC (gotta think about those student loans), but I could've taken 28 to work. And I'll be doing that anyway, except it'll just be more unpleasant. Thanks, Bob Ehrlich.
mike-
Yeah typical talk from someone who hates to see Eastern Montgomery County Progress with more Business Growth and Completed Highways that will help accomodate the People that live in Eastern Montgomery County commute to work in Western Montgomery County faster. Sure any individual can say build a trolley and that will make commuting better, but people with common Intelligence know better than to Believe that building a cheap trolley like light rail would be 100% beneficial for Businesses and Commuters instead of Building New Highways or adding two or four lanes in each direction of an existing four lane bottleneck highway. Virginia continues to build new highways or widen the existing highways and no one raises hell against it but when the thaught of it hits Maryland the so called concerned citizens want to make up "the sky is falling" fake scare tactics in which it is getting old and tired.
The best solution is Complete the ICC, build that little ol' purple line trolley in which it wouldn't benefit me, and then try to discover new revenue funds to help pay for future widening of the Highway 28-198 Connector. It can and shall be done.
Thats real leadership.
by mike on Jun 18, 2009 7:44 pm
by Steve on Jun 18, 2009 7:45 pm
The issue with the ICC isn't that NIMBYs complaining about development are right; it's that its a gross misallocation of resources. Building an outer and inner purple line (a pink line and a purple line?) would have solved for the needs of inner "eastern montgomery" and outer "eastern montgomery" in a far more sustainable way. Passengers/hour per lane-mile capacity is much higher on even light rail than a highway (to speak nothing of heavy rail, which could have been built affordably using cut-and-cover along the ICC path).
Moreover, as transit encourages development, wouldn't you rather commute to a job in E. MoCo rather than W. MoCo?
by RS on Jun 19, 2009 9:06 am
Many places now require a Health Impact Statement in addition to an EIS (they're related afterall) because of the mounting evidence that our built environment is an important element in determining long term health outcomes at the population level.
by Bianchi on Jun 19, 2009 10:28 am
by Bianchi on Jun 19, 2009 10:38 am
Mike, you're trying to be derisive, but Virginia's highway mentality has failed it; look at Gov. Kaine's op-ed in today's post!
me-
Yea it has failed soo bad that it attracts 60% of Maryland commuters to Virginia Every Morning to work in those High Tech Private and Government Contract Offices Between Alexandria and Eastern Loudon County.
RS-
The issue with the ICC isn't that NIMBYs complaining about development are right; it's that its a gross misallocation of resources.
me-
That is the mis-calculation. In reality it is not the NIMBY's Complaining against the ICC ya have to be a resident within a certain radius of the Highway. Most of the people that are making alot of noise against the ICC are not Maryland Tax Paying Citizens and there is very good reason why the people living in the state south of Maryland do not want any Highway like the ICC being built in Maryland is that it will compete against Northern Virginia's Rich Business, Middle/Upper Class Population and High End Retail Growth.
RS-
Building an outer and inner purple line (a pink line and a purple line?) would have solved for the needs of inner "eastern montgomery" and outer "eastern montgomery" in a far more sustainable way.
me-
Oh really then why has it not help Business Growth in Prince Georges County in which Metro Rail have been serving the County since 1977.
RS-
Passengers/hour per lane-mile capacity is much higher on even light rail than a highway (to speak nothing of heavy rail, which could have been built affordably using cut-and-cover along the ICC path).
me-
The light rail in Baltimore that runs between BWI and Downtown runs withing 1-5 Miles east of the Baltimore-Washington Expressway and I have yet to witness reduction in Heavy traffic along the Highway. Plus the people that use the light rail in that part of Baltimore don't own cars and the people that live near it don't use it often, some people nickname the Light Rail as the Loot Rail.
RS-
Moreover, as transit encourages development,
me-
Yet another False Advertisement. Again if that were true then why New Carollton, Greenbelt, Landover, Cheverly, and Addison Road just to name a few does not have the same Development Scale as the Ballston-Rasslyn Corridor or the Pentagon City-Alexandria Corridor.
People like you throw that word "transit encourages development" but that is False because most Transit Corridors were already developed before trasit was built may it be high end development or Industrial low density development.
BTW- I still remember back in 2000 there were planse to build the open areas around Greenbelt Station to look like Crystal City-Pentagon City which would have included a multi-level shopping mall but the same people that say "transit encourages development" shot the Entire plan down by making up enviromental concerns and today Greenbelt remains as an abandond open space with a Huge Park and Ride Parking Lot.
RS-
wouldn't you rather commute to a job in E. MoCo rather than W. MoCo?
me-
I would rather See Eastern Montgomery County and Prince Georges County Complete the Highways that should have been built or widen 35 years ago, Develope Retail Centers like Tyson's Corner, Fair Oaks, and Pentagon City, Attract High Paying Private/Government Contracting Businesses to Eastern Montgomery County and Prince Georges County, and Build the Green Line Extention(the same people that say "transit encourages development" do not support in reason of saying that the MARC Rail already serves BWI but knowingly the Green Line Extention will not Parallel the MARC Corridor) to BWI Airport.
I will continue to repeat as an experiance traveler that Rapid Transit without Highways is not going to encourage more growth or else the people that really believe that would not be using the Transit argument against building/widening Highways.
by mike on Jun 19, 2009 12:48 pm
I'll add that infrastructures like the ICC have unintended, measuarable health detriments and the attendent costs associated with those detriments will burden the economies of the counties and state. These expected and measurable costs were not considered, or ignored. Also not considered or ignored were the positive measurable health affects associated with infrastructures like the purple (and pink) line. One method ends up costing county, state and medicare health dollars by contributing measurably to human disease and suffering and thus contributes to damaging the economic environment. The other method can save health dollars with a measurable prevention effect that adds to economic vitality while aiding in the protection of individuals' health and well-being.
Many places now require a Health Impact Statement in addition to an EIS (they're related afterall) because of the mounting evidence that our built environment is an important element in determining long term health outcomes at the population level.
me-
Once again if all else fails use the Health Scare Tactic.
Where was all of this "Building and Widening Highways will harm your health" noise when VDOT Built that Massive $Billion Springfield Mixing Bowl, Fairfax County, Parkway, Prince William County Parkway, and the Dulles Greewnway Extension.
If building Highways are harmful to ones health then why aren't there any Outbreaks of Legal Issues Nationally of people suffering from Health Hazards because they chosen to live near a busy Highway.
The ICC or any other Maryland state Highway is not a Chemically Toxic Landfill or Three Mile Island Power Plant which have bben proven by Examination to be harmful to ones health not some 6-12 Lane Highway.
by mike on Jun 19, 2009 1:03 pm
I made the assumption that readers are aware that medicare and medicaid are busting the budgets of counties, states and feds and a large measurable portion of that budget goes to preventable disease associated with our built environment; our car-oriented disconnected built environment that is.
me-
Thats strange because I were led to believe the the medicare and medicaid are ruining the budgets because the local government continues to allow/accept Undocument Immigrants from south of the boarder to get medical help in the city, county, and state hospitals. Now who is paying for those Undocument Immigrants to get Medical Treatment without health insurence, is it the tax paying American and Legal Immigrant citizens?????????
by mike on Jun 19, 2009 1:18 pm
From your comment it's apparent you're unaware of the health consequences to which I'm referring. There is ample data. It is available to the public. Here's a place to start getting inforamtion on this exciting and fascinating topic: http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/publications/factsheets/ImpactoftheBuiltEnvironmentonHealth.pdf
by Bianchi on Jun 19, 2009 1:29 pm
by Bianchi on Jun 19, 2009 1:35 pm
Mike, Talk to someone in the VDOH. I'm sure they were trying to be heard. Is it a "scare" if the outcomes are already being lived by people among us and the economics of those outcomes are already burdening the county, state and fed budgets? In any case there are many places that now require a HIS. Expect more communities to adapt this practice. It's in the best interest of the community to do so.
me-
What is VDOH and what does that have to do with the Fact that Virginia continues to build and widen new highways and the same people that raise hell against Highway building and widening in Maryland won't do the same with Virginia.
Bianchi-
From your comment it's apparent you're unaware of the health consequences to which I'm referring. There is ample data. It is available to the public. Here's a place to start getting inforamtion on this exciting and fascinating topic: http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/publications/factsheets/ImpactoftheBuiltEnvironmentonHealth.pdf
me-
Maybe I'm not aware of it because there is No National EVIDENCE of people suing the Government for suffering from Health Hazards of choosing to reside near a Multi-Lane Expressway.
by mike on Jun 19, 2009 6:18 pm
Mike, your over use of puncutation and alarmist diatribe rife with misinformation is a discussion ender.
me-
You just can't handle the fact that I will not buy into cheap arguments that Marylanders would be better off without highways while other states like Virginia, North Carolina, and Georgia continues to build and widen Highways.
by mike on Jun 19, 2009 6:21 pm
If you can see the alternative view, then we can have a debate. If you insist on simply comparing states' activities, then there is no argument here, we're just yelling.
by цarьchitect on Jun 19, 2009 6:51 pm
How exciting for you! There is a whole world for you to discover about the workings of local, state, national and international public and private health organizations and the scientific method as applied to studies on human health! To get you started look up this word: Epidemiology.
by Bianchi on Jun 19, 2009 7:17 pm
by Joe Lorentson on Jun 19, 2009 10:32 pm
Mike, will you admit the possibility that those highways are being built based on erroneous information and misguided planning practices?
me-
The key word is "possibility" and its leaning towards possiblt Not..........
by цarьchitect-
Can you not consider the possibility that your state is being more fiscally prudent with its money, while the others dig themselves into a hole?
ME-
I will believe that when I see a Reverse commute of Heavy Traffic of Virginians commuting to Maryland in the Mornings and the I-270/US 29/I-95 Corridor have Twice as many High Tech Businesses as the Dulles Toll Road/I-66/I-395/95 Corridor.
цarьchitect-
If you can see the alternative view, then we can have a debate.
me-
The best Alternative is to Build/Widen Highways along with adding more Rapid Transit Option not one or the other.
цarьchitect-
If you insist on simply comparing states' activities, then there is no argument here, we're just yelling.
me-
My using Virginia as an example of Building/Widening Highways along with Improving Rapid Transit brings in more Busineses and Development then Maryland which doesn't build alot of Highways but does have sufficient amount of transit options that is not 100% Dependable(doesn't oporate 24 hours) is not arguable because its the Truth. The yelling part comes in when people try to paint this Imaginary picture of more Transit Options instead of Building more highways and widening existing highways will attract Development.
I'll say again if Building Highways attracts unwanted growth then the argument that Rapid Transit attracts Development is a complete double standard in which it can't be a true argument in Favor of more transit options. Its either Highways attract growth and rapid transit attracts development or neither attract more Development Growth.
by mike on Jun 20, 2009 6:16 am
Mike, Virginia Department of Health. I don't get my scientific evidence from lawsuits. I get it from the results of scientific inquiry. Normally institutions such as VDOH, MDOH, MCDOH, PGCDOH, etc. are informed by the latest available data obtained through the scientific method, not law briefs. These institutions also perform their own studies. These studies are funded with local resources, by the NIH and CDC as well as by private foundations interested in public health like Robert Woods Johnson. This way reccomendations can be specific for the population served by the DOH. That's not to say a good lawyer won't or can't dig up information the DOH can use. That would be an exception to how they normally obtain useful data however.
me-
Sorry but its not Hard Evidence that people that choose to live near a Multi-Lane Highway suffer from Health Hazars. What ou are stating from the "study" is based solidly on one's Opinion and Cold Hard Evidentual Facts.
Bianchi-
How exciting for you! There is a whole world for you to discover about the workings of local, state, national and international public and private health organizations and the scientific method as applied to studies on human health! To get you started look up this word: Epidemiology.
me-
Again there is Noo such evidence of people that "choose" to live near multi-lane Highways suffer from Health Hazards.
by mike on Jun 20, 2009 6:27 am
Dan Reed, you can thank Bob Ehrlich, but it is Martin O'Malley who kept the project going,
me-
He has no choice in that and the last person who had the power to stop the project was Parris Glendenning in which he tried to sell off the Right of Way for some Housing Development in which he was not successful in doing thank goodness.
Lorentson-
it is Martin O'Malley who promised a purple line and didn't deliver
me-
O'Malley promised the purple line but he and the purple line supporters did not Confirm to the General Tax Paying Public that the Purple Line is not a Heavy Rail Subway because the people that I spoke with in PG County were led to believe that it was a Heavy Rail Subway and not some Slow Running Trolley Style Light Rail.
Lorentson-
and it is Martin O'Malley who raised my taxes enough to make it a tough decision to stay in MD or leave. It is stay for now. When the Mrs goes back to work, it is move because we'll be back into upper income threshhold. Sad.
me-
Don't forget about the Computer Tax that he proposed but was voted down in which it would have pushed the few High Tech Businesses in Central Maryland to relocate South to one of the Counties in High Tech Rich Northern Virgnia.
by mike on Jun 20, 2009 6:41 am