Kudos to this plan for straying off the existing MARC right of way.

However, it carries the same issues with any of these plans to extend Metro along existing commuter rail ROW. Why not take that money and use it to expand and enhance MARC service? What if you could use that and make MARC operate more like some of the commuter rail services in New York - fairly frequent headways, weekend and late night service, etc. Such a program would almost certainly be more cost-effective than extending Metro out this far. It would also do more to encourage TOD at stations.

I do like the fact that this proposal cuts across Fort Meade and connects the two MARC lines, however.

by Alex B. on Oct 28, 2009 10:52 am  

Forget Fort Meade for an endpoint...send it all the way up to BWI.

Though, as Alex did and BDC and others will likely argue, it'd be more cost effective to upgrade MARC.

by Froggie on Oct 28, 2009 11:04 am  

Dave,
As always, an excellent imagination.

I tend to agree with Alex B. that beyond a certain distance from the city-center, it makes more sense to improve commuter rail lines. If Camden Line trains came every 20 minutes in each direction from 5A-12A and included weekend service, we could have better service to Laurel and Fort Meade without as much investment as is required for heavy rail.

However, I believe that much of the Green Line envisioned here lies in Arundel County. The Patuxent River separates Prince George's County from Howard and Arundel with the B&O tracks separating Howard from Arundel. That means that all the stops north of Laurel (Central) are outside of PG County, and therefore outside of their Transportation Master Plan.

How does the Arundel portion tie in with the PG plan?

by Matt Johnson on Oct 28, 2009 11:06 am  

I agree, from a regional perspective, the money would be better spent on MARC upgrades. More frequent weekday, and new weekday night and weekend service on the Penn line, and a direct rail link into BWI Airport, ala SEPTA's in Philadelphia. It could certainly piggybank on top of the stimulus requests Maryland has already submitted for adding a fourth track to Amtrak's NEC between Landover and West Baltimore.

by Paul on Oct 28, 2009 11:11 am  

more rail is better- no matter what.
However- the problem with turning the Metro into a commuter line is that they never ever seem to consider more TRACKS and express trains. I know of people in Laurel who would also take MARC- but MARC also makes stops at every darned station and it can be held up by freight trains.

We need more rights of way for passenger rail and more express trains separated from local tracks.

I also agree that this is nice since it is separate from the regular MARC right of way and a new ROW is created.

by w on Oct 28, 2009 11:31 am  

+1 on improving MARC,

but if you want to serve Fort Meade it seems extending the Blue Line makes more sense.

The 16 mile Green line extension gets you to:

Beltsville (population: 15,000)
Laurel (20,000)
Jessup (8,000)
Fort Meade
Odenton

A 13 mile Blue line extension gets you to

Lanham-Seabrook (18,000)
Glen Dale (12,000)
Bowie (50,000)
Odenton
and with a small detour from the rail ROW to Fort Meade

So taking Fort Meade and Odenton out of the mix, for 3 fewer miles and a line almost all within a ROW, you serve 37,000 more people. The ONLY reason the green line extension is the favored option is Konterra. Personally I don't think that developers should be the ones making transit decisions. If Konterra wants to pay to extend the Green Line, than fine, but I'm no more eager to help them make a bundle off their investment than I am National Harbor.

by David C on Oct 28, 2009 11:44 am  

Above, I meant Orange line. More coffee needed.

by David C on Oct 28, 2009 11:45 am  

Here's my two-part plan for better service at less cost:

1. Build a new track along the existing MARC ROW for passenger service only. Operate MARC like a real transit service.

2. Follow the Corridor Cities Transitway model and build a busway or LRT line going cross-town between Columbia and Fort Meade.

Now instead of a long and expensive Metro ride to a limited number of destinations, you've got an express trip to downtown Washington or Baltimore, and good local service to the harder-to-reach destinations. More service, less money.

by BeyondDC on Oct 28, 2009 11:47 am  

To clarify, the master plan shows a connection to Anne Arundel County, but as Matt' said, anything north of the county line is not in the master plan and is my speculative design.

@Alex B.: Upgrades to the existing MARC right-of-way would not service Fort Meade, which is the largest job center in the state of Maryland. that's 50,000+ jobs that aren't serviced by ANY major transportation. I don't see how this problem is any different than the Tysons Corner/Reston solution provided by the Silver Line. The Camden Line, even with upgrades, offers a pretty poor level of service. It will never induce much transit use along the Rt. 1 corridor.

@Froggie, I think a Baltimore transit connection to Ft. Meade ought to provide the connection to BWI. No reason both systems shouldn't go to Fort Meade. Yes, it is more cost effective in the short term to upgrade a service that doesn't serve the job centers, but that becomes a gigantic issue that goes unresolved.

by Dave Murphy on Oct 28, 2009 11:48 am  

@BDC: I don't see this Metro Ride as being much longer or more expensive than a ride to Shady Grove or Dulles, and once again it would go to an enormous job center that is critically unserved by transit. An LRT or bus service from Columbia would be a great complimentary service, much like a Rt 7 light rail in Fairfax County would compliment the Silver Line or the CCT for the Red Line. But it is not a solution.

@ David C: The Penn Line has a much higher current level of service than the Camden Line currently (and after proposed MARC renovations). The areas served are not as conducive to transit oriented development as the Route 1 Corridor. Your population analysis is flawed, in that a stop in Bowie does not serve Bowie's 50,000 people, which live spread out over a large area entirely south of the station, whereas Laurel (which has a municipal population of 20,000, but a very large population living in dense areas not counted in the municipal population, about 60,000 more people) would be centrally served. The Route 1 corridor also has strong, continuous retail markets not present along the Penn Line.

by Dave Murphy on Oct 28, 2009 11:59 am  

Another Vote to improve MARC. It appears that in their Master Plan there will lots of extra track built that should support more service including a spur to the front gate of Fort Meade and on to Odenton. MARC could run lines from Baltimore and Union Station then.

by NikolasM on Oct 28, 2009 12:00 pm  

Here's another idea: If Columbia seems too complicated, how about running that Ft Meade LRT/BRT I suggested as an extension of a Columbia Pike line? Like so.

by BeyondDC on Oct 28, 2009 12:03 pm  

I agree with BeyondDC. Although people commute to Ft. Meade, a lot of the people who work there live in Anne Arundel, PG and Howard counties, along with MoCo and B'more. Having mass transit service along the CCT and MARC upgraded seem like more effective solutions. Upgrading our commuter rail needs to be a higher priority, in general.

by Vik on Oct 28, 2009 12:06 pm  

Another option to improving MARC is making Amtrak cheaper on the weekends. If Maryland subsidized weekend Amtrak tickets that start and end at a combination of Baltimore, BWI, New Carrollton and DC so that they are at MARC weekday prices, that might be cheaper than running their own trains. Of course that only deals with the Camden line.

by David C on Oct 28, 2009 12:22 pm  

I wish the BRAC had considered moving to the literally dozens of vacant lots next to existing PG County Metro stations, or Springfield / Van Dorn, etc instead of out to Belvoir and Fort Meade...

I'd love to put heavy METRO everywhere, but realistically most outside the beltway locations are so low density /intensity that you have to run an enormous length of track ($$) to serve 2 or 3 stations. Whereas building the same length of track inside the beltway (for instance, in the METRO vacant but densly populated Route 7/Bailey's/Landmark/Shirlington areas) would hit very close to something like half a million people. More "bang for your buck".

I do however see an upgrading of MARC as a great option for Fort Meade, etc.

by stevek_fairfax on Oct 28, 2009 1:02 pm  

Inside the Beltway, "Landmark/Tysons/Shirlington"...Same Length of Track:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF&msa=0&msid=
113262488393877820698.000477019f40c244f8a62

by stevek_fairfax on Oct 28, 2009 1:07 pm  

OK, let's try this link:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=113262488393877820698.000477019f40c244f8a62&ll=38.859494,-77.14222&spn=0.203446,0.44529&t=h&z=12

by stevek_fairfax on Oct 28, 2009 1:10 pm  

If the issues regarding distance from Ft. Meade to MARC, as Dave already pointed out, can be overcome, then yes upgrading MARC could be an option for Ft. Meade.

As for Belvoir, that one would involve a bit of buckage plus construction time, but extending the Yellow Line south to Belvoir would both give that base a major transit connection *AND* give Fairfax County an opportunity to do along Route 1 what Arlington has done with Ballston-Rosslyn.

by Froggie on Oct 28, 2009 3:21 pm  

This would be great for Tipton Airport (I used to fly out of there). Sadly, after 9/11, College Park airport was closed down to almost everyone, and it's very hard to get in there. If there is heavy rail transit to Tipton, that will really change things around for people flying here in personal airplanes - Gaithersburg, Manassas, and Frederick are all not close to good mass transit options.

by Aaron on Oct 28, 2009 3:38 pm  

A cheap way to connect the Odenton MARC station and Fort Meade might be a 1.5 mile aerial tram like the one proposed for Baltimore. Security could check people before they boarded the tram. With trams arriving every 10 seconds, it would be more satisfying than waiting for a bus.

http://www.baltimorelift.com/approach.htm

by David C on Oct 28, 2009 3:43 pm  

Rather than doing a 16-mile extension at the north end of the green, wouldn't it be more sensible on a passenger-per-mile basis to do the 2-mile extension of the south end, so that it crosses the Beltway and terminates on Andrews AFB, with its 20,000 employees and residents?

by tom veil on Oct 28, 2009 3:43 pm  

I disagree with the statement Fort Meade "is currently unserved by transit." There is a MARC Station in Odenton on the Penn Line, an Army shuttle service to the base itself - http://www.ftmeade.army.mil/pages/shuttle/sched032009.pdf, and CTC route K - http://www.aacounty.org/PlanZone/Transportation/Transit.cfm . These aren't high-quality, but there is existing service.

by Steve on Oct 28, 2009 3:46 pm  

Tom: agree with that one too.

by Froggie on Oct 28, 2009 4:24 pm  

Actually, take the south end past Andrews to the north and then into Westphalia.

by цarьchitect on Oct 28, 2009 5:15 pm  

Where is the point when we say enough is enough just curious, with the amount of extensions people want from metrorail how far are we from it just becoming Marc and VRE version 2.

How far are we from people suggesting metrorail go Fredricksburg or Hunt Valley. The system should go no futher than eastern Loudoun, northeastern Prince William counties in virginia and northern Charles, western Anne Arundel, southern Howard in Maryland anything beyond those should be either new lines or a metro style commuter rail system.

by kk on Oct 28, 2009 5:48 pm  

Actually, I'd have to agree with several posts ... I think to access Ft. Meade may actually work out by extending the Orange up towards Odenton and Ft. Meade and BWI ... as for the Green Line, yes Beltsville and Laurel need service, but the logical choice would be to send it west along Rt. 32 to Columbia --- both places would have the ability to link up with the Baltimore Light Rail (planned and existing)

by coneyraven on Oct 28, 2009 5:58 pm  

To KK, BDC, tom and other's points, it's around 20 miles from the Washington Monument to Route 772 is 25 miles, to Shady Grove is 20 miles, and to most other termini it's only 10-15.

To Meade would be 30 miles, and to BWI, it would be 35. Maybe Metro to Laurel, but MARC anywhere further or an airport shuttle are much more reasonable.

by цarьchitect on Oct 28, 2009 6:04 pm  

I hear it's already awful to get to the NSA in the morning. With more people moving into Fort Meade it's just going to get worse. I think the reason to do something like this is more to get people to Fort Meade than into DC. So, I don't think improvements to MARC are a good alternative.

I don't know where Fort Meade employees live now, but I doubt a huge percentage of them live on the proposed Green line extension. It still might take sense to do it. The extension would likely spur more dense development around the metro stations, and Fort Meade employees might be attracted to those new developments.

You'd probably have to find a way to create some dedicated lanes for buses that would feed people to the Fort. Light rail would be nice, but, at least to me, there aren't any obvious routes that would act as a good feeder line to both the Fort and the Green line.

by Andy R on Oct 28, 2009 6:39 pm  

- This is a long haul for Metrorail, especially if there are stops in between. Improvements to MARC service may be a better bang for the buck, as both Ft Meade & BWI run excellent shuttle services to their respective stations. Don't be too quick to dismiss transit options that aren't on rails.

- The previous comment aside: the Laurel stations are exactly what I'd plotted, myself. However, I'm not sure I agree with Savage or the National Business Park... maybe one of those, at best. ...And I say that as someone who lives within walking distance of both stations :P The Annapolis Junction development might generate some ridership, at least, assuming that project ever gets moving.

- When I laid out this area, I envisioned keeping HRT along the CSX line and linking it to Ft Meade via LRT. I was personally a bit skeptical of the expense of running HRT so far... but then again, LRT could entail transfers -- adding to travel time -- and the cost of running LRT to yet other destinations could also become quite high. Did you give any thought toward HRT vs LRT?

- Here are my own ideas, though admittedly an early draft that I still intend to edit considerably:

http://philatransport.blogspot.com/2009/10/preview-of-north.html

by Bossi on Oct 28, 2009 9:12 pm  

Er... and by "LRT" I also intend to include streetcars/trams and so forth; essentially any variety of lower-capacity alternatives to Metrorail.

by Bossi on Oct 28, 2009 9:19 pm  

Here's the main difference between road and transit folks: Unity.

Someone suggests (in a silly mood): Let's throw 4 billion at I-270, and all start cheering.

Someone suggests an extension of the green line, and all start arguing over details. No, MARC should be better! No, it should be the blue, sorry, blue, why not Silver line! Why not VRE?

Just sayin'

by Jasper on Oct 28, 2009 9:24 pm  

To Andy's point above, most younger employees at Fort Meade live in downtown Baltimore, Capitol Hill, or Arlington. Some live in Annapolis, few live in Columbia. The shuttle services from the MARC stations are long, over capacity and do not come often. Dedicated bus lanes, or even a shuttle from Greenbelt, would sure be a good start.

To Tsarchitect's point, I think the line would serve commuters to Fort Meade primarily. TOD in Prince George's County could induce Fort Meade employees to move to there in the future. Good urbanism, access to the city and work via transit.

As far as making Kingdon Gould rich by running transit to his development at Konterra, the Muirkirk/Konterra station would be a mile away from where the town center is currently planned. If a Metro station there induced better land use between the planned town center and the station (currently it is car-oriented office parks), I can't imagine how that would be a bad thing.

by Dave Murphy on Oct 28, 2009 9:34 pm  

I've long thought the best thing to do would be to link Columbia to Ft Meade and both to the Camden AND Penn lines. If the Growth and Expansion plan ever gets off the group you would have quad tracking through Odenton and triple tracking through Laurel and Savage.

Anyway I finally got off my but and mapped out a potential line that would link the two.
http://www.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=106848754460152682196.000477088bbefbccca6b4&z=13

By running this connector on short segments of the Camden and Penn lines you do a couple things:
- The possibility now exists to switch cars and equipment at someplace other than Union Station or East Baltimore
- You could run shorter distance trains that don't terminate in Baltimore or DC, that is you could have a Columbia-DC, Columbia-Baltimore, Ft Meade-DC, Ft Meade to Baltimore trains and any of those four could use time slots on either the Penn or Camden which opens up a host of possibilities.
- By finally bringing Howard County's largest population center at least partially (the above map only extends to 1 Columbia stop as its rather minimalist in some ways if not others) in to the MARC system should create a whole new demand and supply center.

by Greg on Oct 28, 2009 9:56 pm  

Dave: Out of curiosity, how do you know where Fort Meade employees live? I don't have any first-hand knowledge, other than knowing a few younger NSA employees, but I find it a little hard to believe that "most" of them live in downtown Baltimore, Capitol Hill, and Arlington. Even going against the general rush hour traffic, that wouldn't be a very pleasant commute. There will probably be lots of employees commuting from Virginia when DISA moves up to Fort Meade, but I really wouldn't expect a lot of people to live in Virginia now. Most of the people I know at Fort Meade either live in one of the Laurels, Columbia, or Silver Spring. But, I certainly don't have a representative sample.

Also, the 3 places you mentioned are pretty expensive places to live, even for this area. And NSA doesn't pay their new, young employees terribly well, even compared to other government agencies.

I don't work at Fort Meade, or even interact with Fort Meade employees terribly often, so I could be wrong.

by Andy R on Oct 28, 2009 10:00 pm  

Andy- Fair question. I work on Fort Meade as I have mentioned in other posts. Many military personnel who live off post live in those areas you mentioned, but most people I have met in new-hire programs for civilians on the base are living in the downtowns. I should have mentioned Silver Spring as well, that seems to be a popular settling spot.

They are not cheap places to live, and we do not get paid exorbitant wages. But my "Capitol Hillbilly" friends live in row houses rented with several other people. I know quite a few who chose to live near Union Station so they could take MARC to work on the shuttles, but ultimately abandoned that method because of the quality and frequency of the shuttles and their disdain for a cumbersome modal shift in their commute.

Unfortunately, I have heard numerous accounts of new hires being warned NOT to live in Prince George's County despite its several MARC stations and proximity to the base. I feel that Prince George's would be an ideal place for young employees to get affordable housing near Metro (potentially with good urbanism) and still have easy access to work.

To address your other point, it is not a pleasant commute at all, even going against traffic. But it is a sacrifice many people (including myself, soon) are willing to make for the opportunity to live somewhere that offers the advantages and experiences of the city.

by Dave Murphy on Oct 29, 2009 3:28 am  

I thought the problem with transit to Ft Meade (or Ft Belvoir), or putting BRAC sites on top of transit in the first place, was the whole setback issue. The idea being that major rail access creates major security issues. Personally, I never understood how having a Metro stop on a miltary base is any more dangerous than having THOUSANDS of automobiles rolling in.

by monkeyrotica on Oct 29, 2009 8:34 am  

The benefit of beefed-up MARC service is that you'd connect to both DC and Baltimore.

The thing is, Fort Meade's pretty sprawling. That's not surprising for a Military base, but it's not going to make it easy to get around. Local governments should work on getting agreements for the military to operate a shuttle with substantial frequencies, etc.

by Alex B. on Oct 29, 2009 8:35 am  

Great idea. As a Laurel resident the availability would definitely make the community more desirable. Of course, just building a light rail from Laurel to Ft Meade would make sense...if we could get the Camden line to have the 1 x hr schedule it once had, and run on weekends. We seem to want to reinvent the wheel with trains -- public policy should be geared to using routes already in existence -- CSX's desires should't take precedence over public policy that would save billions (likely) in construction costs.

by Karen L on Oct 29, 2009 8:41 am  

I wholeheartedly agree on the need for internal shuttles if rail transit were brought out to Ft Meade -- akin to what Navy Memorial & NIH already do, though the former can be a bit lacking. One thing to keep in mind, however, is that from my experience the bureaucracy involved with getting funding for a shuttle service is pretty hefty: my understanding is that area governments would be dealing with the Pentagon; not just the base itself. That starts dabbling in the role of combined State & Federal authorities; not just County or Municipal governments.

by Bossi on Oct 29, 2009 8:41 am  

Once upon a time, there was a branch line that came off the B&O Capital Sub (MARC's Camden Line) near the present-day Savage station. This location is to this day called "Annapolis Jct." The branch cut across Ft. Meade and ran at least at far as Odenton. My Maryland DeLorme atlas still shows the right-of-way.

by Paul on Oct 29, 2009 8:42 am  

David C. believes a Blue Line extension would better serve MD based on the population centers he chose to highlight.
I live in Columbia and would consider using a closer Green Line at Ft Meade or Laurel when I need to work at the Pentagon instead of driving to NOVA or going to Greenbelt. The MARC Camden line stations are the closest yet are at least 5 miles or more in distance and the Camden Line does not run as regularly as the Penn Line or Metro, has a lower priority track usage to Freight & AMTRAK, and you still need to take the Metro from Greenbelt or Union Station to get where you need to go. An extended Metro Line to Laurel/Savage/Ft Meade and/or Columbia - pop. 95,000 +, would serve us better. Rt 175 West would still need lane expansion from Ft Meade gate(s) at Mapes Road, Reece and/ or Rockenbach to US 1.

by AV on Oct 29, 2009 12:49 pm  

Paul - I think that's the old WB&A ROW that ran from the B&O at Savage, crossed PRR at Odenton, then continued on to Annapolis. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington,_Baltimore_and_Annapolis_Electric_Railroad

by Steve on Oct 29, 2009 1:11 pm  

@Dave Murphy. Even if only 13,000 of Bowie's 50k people live near the train station, that still means the same number of people as along the longer green line alignment. While Route 1 has more commercial development than Lanham-Severn Road it isn't exactly transit or pedestrian friendly, so wherever a Metro extension happened there would be more work to do.

@AV - a green line extension would be closer to Columbia. And an Orange line extension would be closer to all of the communities to the east (Crofton, southern Bowie, etc...) I don't know the exact breakdown of population, but if the goal is transit to Fort Meade the straight line seems the better option. Coming in from the west is designed to help Konterra, not Columbia.

by David C on Oct 29, 2009 1:15 pm  

If there was something going toward Ft. Meade why not also go to Arundel Mills, Severn, Glen Burnie; Arundel Mills alone would probably get more riders than all other stops besides Laurel and Ft. Meade on the extension.

by Kk on Oct 29, 2009 10:51 pm  

@kk-
That's exactly what I'd initially tried to do with my alignments linked above, but the problem I'm running into with that is getting *around* Ft Meade within a reasonable fashion whilst also maintaining decent service to the Fort itself. I highly doubt going through the base would fly, which is where I originally ran my hypothetical line.

by Bossi on Oct 29, 2009 11:06 pm  

Having commuted from Laurel/Savage to downtown DC several years taking the MARC train, I believe that the trip on the Green Line from Laurel/Savage would take too long to get to downtown. It takes forever just to get to Gallery Place from Greenbelt. My suggestion would be to connect the College Park Metro Station with the Union Station Metro Station via CSX right-of-way, with stops in Riverdale, Hyattsville, etc. It would cost another chunk of change but it would be worth it.

The other alternative is to upgrade the existing railroad right-of-way with two new tracks to accommodate MARC exclusively along side the existing CSX tracks. It has already been done for all new commuter rail lines in Utah and New Mexico. Having separate tracks will eliminate conflicts between passenger and freight service.

One other observation. The MARC trains have restrooms on-board its passenger cars and Metrorail cars do not. A long trip to DC from Laurel/Savage could be a problem for anybody who just had a cup of coffee. I see that to also be a problem traveling from Dulles Airport to DC as well and should be studied. Otherwise commuters may find another way to work.

by Joe A. on Oct 30, 2009 12:18 am  

Joe, you are more than welcome to continue to use the MARC Service. The METRO Subway can be for the people that don't want to pay the MARC Train Prices. The Distance from BWI to Downtown DC on the Green Line is no Different than the Silver Line Subway from Loudon County to DC.

by Jason on Oct 30, 2009 2:40 am  

@Jason
The current one way rush hour price to go from Greenbelt Station to Gallery Place is $3.65 and takes 26 minutes
For a MARC train from Odenton (Ft Meade) to Union Station your one way price is $5 and take 21 minutes on the Penn Line
For a MARC train from Savage (Ft Meade) to Union Station your one way price is also $5 and takes an average of 40 minutes on the Camden line

In other words any hypothetical line to Laurel, Savage, and or Ft Meade is going to be just as long and probably longer in terms of time and almost certainly just as costly in terms of price as those stations will likley be closer to the $4.50 max fare.

None of that even begins to factor in to the relative cost factors of new rail cars for the green line, eminent domain costs, etc. Expanding the Camden line to 3 tracks for the entire length of line between DC and the Patapsco river woudl cost something in the neighborhood of $400m. Based on the Silver Line costs I don't think anyone would suggest that a Green Line expansion would be anywhere near as cheap.

by Greg on Oct 30, 2009 1:31 pm  

Most regular MARC commuters buy a monthly pass, which significantly reduces the cost of a daily round trip cost to Union Station. So for a typical commute it would be an unfair to compare regular one-way MARC fairs with one-way Metrorail fares. Also, MetroChecks further reduces the cost of the commute of MARC passengers with monthly passes.

As far as schedules are concerned, a lot depends on whether regular trains are taken or express train are taken. For example, after moving to Ann Arundel County, I took an express train from on the MARC Penn line from Odenton to Union Station that took 23 minutes. With dedicated track on the CSX alignment, the same service could be achieved on the MARC Camden line.

I still believe that building a new Metrorail line from College Park to Union Station would provide the best service from Laurel/Savage and beyond. The problem would be capacity on the existing Red line tracks to handle the additional rolling stock from the alternate Green line. If that problem could be overcome, it would add a whole new dimension to the Metrorail system. Perhaps Union Station would be a terminal for the alternate Green line until a new alignment is built for the District.

I am confident that the cost of extending Metrorail to Ft. Meade would be in the billions of dollars. I think the money would be better spent on building light rail along the MD 32 alignment to get commuters from Columbia and beyond to Ft. Meade and its military and non-military tenants. The stations would need lots of parking lot capacity.

As far as distances go, whether from Louden or BWI to DC, what is relevant is the time it takes to get from one point to another. It will be a problem if a comfort station is needed.

I no longer commute to work on the MARC trains or Metrorail or any kind of bus or drive. I don't commute to work at all. I retired from the Federal government in April, 2004. I sold my house and moved away to a less stressful and taxing environment in lower Alabama, a few miles north of the Gulf coast. Nice weather here. Traffic? What traffic?

by Joe A. on Nov 2, 2009 11:53 pm  

Metro expansion conversations on Twitter today led me to this article that I missed when it was written.

Couple of assumptions.

1) Since a Green line extension, Orange line extension or a MARC service upgrade would be entirely contained in Maryland, there would be very little to no money from the District or Virginia contributed to the expansion project. I'd expect significant dollars contributed by the Feds via the ARRP Act.

2) A transit upgrade would primarily benefit Ft Meade personnel connecting them with the Pentagon and the Agencies in DC.

3) A transit upgrade would require reciprocal benefit to other Metro constituencies (DC, airport commuters to compete with the Dulles Silver line extension, etc).

4) A transit upgrade cannot assume commuters are okay to simply keep transferring. Commuters will elect to find other jobs in other business districts where the hassle of the commute is considerably less or move to be "Metro accessible" in some cases.

Given these assumptions, the primary purpose of a green line extension should be dual-focuses: To serve Ft. Meade and to service BWI. Virginia and DC residents look at BWI for affordable air fares (via Southwest, generally) but find getting to BWI problematic. Own the DC and VA commuters by selling them on getting to BWI, not getting to Ft. Meade. MD commuters will benefit from the Ft. Meade angle.

Secondly, MARC upgrades, while needed, address a different problem entirely. No one having to go to the Pentagon is going to want a MARC upgrade because they will have to get take that train to Union Station, jump on the Red line, go two stops to Chinatown, transfer, get on the Yellow line down to the Pentagon. Or go to Metro Center and transfer to the Blue line for the same result. With a Green line extension, you ride into L'Enfant Plaza, make one switch and you're at the Pentagon.

You could, if you really wanted to get creative, extend the Red line from Glenmont but the right of ways don't work in your favor on that plan. However, you eliminate >1 transfer points. That's if the Pentagon commute is the driving force behind the extender.

Personally, I think you have TOO many stops on your green line prediction map. I'd get rid of the Laurel, Savage/AJ, and NSA stops and add Severn (Rt 170/Rt 100 interchange), BWI Rail Station (MARC/Amtrak) and BWI Airport (Terminal/Light Rail).

That connects BWI Airport, the Baltimore Light Rail and Amtrak/MARC and services Ft. Meade and the Business Park (both of which can serve the limited purpose NSA stop).

Anyways, will be interesting. Something needs to happen here. Sorry I'm late to the game.

by Aaron Brazell on Jan 25, 2010 12:13 pm