Comments on Greenbelt bus riders need some shade - Greater Greater Washington

Comment by Capt. Hilts

Sun, 08 Jul 2012 07:48:17 EDT

You have my full sympathy, tour guide.

This area seems to have been designed by Yankees who think that being out in the sun is what you do in the summer. That works on Cape Cod or in New Hampshire, but not down here.

It's HOT here more than it is COLD and design for public spaces needs to reflect that.

Sincerely - whose bright idea was it to have people stand in enclosed areas without shade to wait for buses in this region's prolonged summer?

Comment by tour guide

Sun, 08 Jul 2012 03:00:21 EDT

If our elected officials had to take public transit to BWI, not only would the bus bays be sheltered but the green line would be extended all the way to the airport. On Monday afternoon I spent a VERY hot 50 minutes waiting for the B30 bus. The bus was delayed and the wait was even more painful.

Comment by Bob Smith

Thu, 05 Jul 2012 08:54:43 EDT

@GREENBELT - YES, YES, YES! I thought I was the only one to realize this horrible conflict of buses/cars/bikes/peds. With all that space, it seems ridiculous that all these things have conflicts at several choke points.

I use the tunnel to travel over to College Park - not to access Metro. Inbound usually isn't bad for me.

Exiting by bike is always fun at rush hour - to try and get to the Kiss and Ride through the throng of people through the tiny pathway... or exiting via a "Do Not Enter" ramp. I was wondering if WMATA PD was going to say anything to me.

Maybe one day it will be better. I'm waiting now to see how the new round-a-bout thing plays into the trip. FUN!

Comment by Greenbelt

Thu, 05 Jul 2012 08:20:42 EDT

I think it's worth mentioning that the whole layout of the Greenbelt station is sort of bizarre, not just the bus waiting area. There's that whole underutilized, close-in section of parking lot where the Bolt Bus loads that was designed (I guess) only for commuters who exited the beltway from from the north? The separation of the parking sections with the center walkway creates a congested bottleneck at the kiss and ride, since everyone pulls to the very front, closest to the station entrance. There are no bike lanes or route markings, so it's difficult to know where you're supposed to bike in the whole station: on the sidewalk by the bus stops? (NO), in the bus lane? (PROBABLY BEST), in the kiss and ride? (DISASTER)?

The bike parking is substandard, the motorcycle and scooter parking is way on the far side of the ridiculously long and underused short term pull-in waiting area, there's no shade or landscaping at all, the whole waiting and loading and bike parking areas are out of view of the station managers' booth, which is a crime issue, etc. etc. The west side lack sufficient bike racks, so people lock up to the MARC path railing.

I've always just presumed that Metro never wanted to redesign the parking and waiting and access areas because WMATA was always waiting for the site development that never came... But this was a bizarre initial design, that's for sure. The design is about as person hostile as I can imagine, and it's not great for cars either.

Comment by Capt. Hilts

Wed, 04 Jul 2012 01:50:02 EDT

I'll also note that at the Arlington station the only benches at platform level are...in the FULL SUN.

Comment by Capt. Hilts

Wed, 04 Jul 2012 01:48:22 EDT

SILVER SPRING ALSO!

I got headaches every day from having to wait in the full sun for the Z8 at Silver Spring in the early afternoon in the summer of '91. It was brutal. It was physically debilitating to me as I would lose the rest of my afternoon trying to deal with the headache and fatigue.

You'd think designers don't understand that this area is hot for more of the year than it is cold.

Comment by T. Carter

Tue, 03 Jul 2012 15:47:53 EDT

If WMATA wanted to be really innovative, they could look at some sort of solar shade system, both in the parking lot and by the bus bays ... Generate energy and create shade at the same time ...

Comment by Jasper

Tue, 03 Jul 2012 09:02:46 EDT

Let's conclude that this is failure of shared responsibilities. Bus operators are busy keeping their buses riding, metrorail is busy riding trains, and all forget about the bus stops.

I will agree that at Franconia-Springfield (and probably a whole bunch of other stations), the bus stops are a mess. The place is terribly planned. The linear lay-out leaves buses blocking each other constantly. Especially since the Fairfax Connector has changed its schedule significantly a year or so ago. Somehow they schedule things so that two buses are scheduled to use a single bay quite frequently, leading to much confusion and buses being in the wrong bay.

Another pet-peeve on F-S is that the pedestrian crossing for the bus lane is just *not* under the pedestrian bridge. Which means that when it rains, you have to step out in the rain to cross the road. Stupid.

Comment by jnb

Tue, 03 Jul 2012 09:00:43 EDT

@jim

Responsibility for this is ambiguous. WMATA has the authority to program funds for this kind of investment out of its capital program, but these "conveniences" are competing against higher priority "basic system" safety and state of good repair needs. As a result, WMATA often doesn't fund these kinds of projects and leaves it to local jurisdictions to handle.

The WMATA Board hasn't coherently addressed capital program funding priorities - de facto, the policy is to fund state of good repair and safety investments and everything else -- growth, amenities, etc. -- will be addressed by local governments. The Board is starting to tackle policy in this area, but hasn't gotten far yet.

Comment by Michael Perkins

Tue, 03 Jul 2012 08:52:44 EDT

The West Falls Church bus canopy was paid for by Fairfax County using Virginia CMAQ funds.

Perhaps Prince Georges County could pay for a similar canopy?

Comment by Gray

Tue, 03 Jul 2012 06:59:58 EDT

I'll echo the above comment about the canopy over the North bus bays at WFC. It's the only station where I've used buses, so I had no idea it was so far from being a universal thing. But it provides shade and some protection from rain.

Anybody know how it got there?

Comment by kk

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 23:49:03 EDT

Its the same at every damn station where buses stop for the most part I have never been to a station where all the bus shelters are covered providing shade to everyone except Bethesda and Pentagon. They dont even need trees per say just something that blocks the sun maybe less glass on the boths and more metal covering them.

Another issue is why hell are stops so damn far from the actual station. At many of the stations the stops could have been located hundreds of feet closer. Looking at Greenbelt there could have been stops along the loop cutting the distance between stops and the station by atleast half if not more.

@ Turnip
The same at College Park, Anacostia, Deanwood, Twinbrook, Landover, Cheverly, New Carrolton, Addison Road, Naylor Rd, Vienna (is just a god damn mess before and now with the construction)

At Ft Totten, Naylor Rd, Franconia Springfield & Greenbelt its probably near 1/8 of a mile beween the first and last bus stops for no good reason. God forbid you have to transfer between buses because you will likely miss your connection if its less than 5 minutes.

Comment by jcs

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 22:38:29 EDT

Rich: The other reason to avoid the B30 is that, when traffic gets bad, scheduled buses randomly fail to show up, adding up to an hour to the wait time.

Who wants to add an extra hour to their airport transit time to compensate for the buses not showing up?

Comment by Transport.

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 22:13:53 EDT

West Falls Church has a nice canopy over all of the bus bays on the north side of the station. Does anyone know how that was planned and constructed. The West Falls canopy is similar to the canopy at the Pentagon bus center.

Comment by Turnip

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 20:03:17 EDT

Another problem with Greenbelt is, it's too spread out. Each of the 5 dozen bus routes has its own plot of real estate. To get to BWI airport, you have to walk through two time zones and a weather pattern. No doubt the size contributes to the difficulty of civilizing the space. But, you know what would make it at least a bit nicer, is if they decorated each plot differently, like at the Museum of the American Indian, or the different rooms at the Botanic Garden.

Comment by jim

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 20:02:54 EDT

Whose responsibility is it? WMATA's or the local jurisdiction? Alexandria is redoing the busbays at King St.

Comment by Rich

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 19:10:48 EDT

This is the main reason I try to take MARC to BWI even though getting to Union Station is a bit of hassle relative to just getting on the Green Line. Shady Grove is also unpleasant, even though there's a garage rather than asphalt. The Phoenix solution would raise safety concerns. the Pentagon solution would be great with sufficient overhang.

Comment by Mike

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 19:06:47 EDT

Note the tidy power lines for the light rail. Why do tpeople get their panties in a bunch about having these in DC. Done right they are hardly noticeable. Even over north cap and H St would barely be seen among all the other visual clutter on this so called scenic vista

Comment by Neil Flanagan

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 18:46:09 EDT

I don't think that the bus shelters should be totally opaque - the older ones are dingy enough as they are, and I don't think they'd benefit from being any darker.

The shelters need to be inviting and useful during the cold, rain, and wind as well as the heat. Maybe a brise-soleil is ideal?

Comment by Planner

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 17:59:02 EDT

There should be shade created by high-density mixed-use development on the site!

Comment by selxic

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 17:53:22 EDT

Jasper, yes.

Comment by Tina

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 17:03:19 EDT

sheets of transparent tinted adhesive on the plexi walls and ceiling would help and be cheap and maybe even attractive; e.g. in abstract or figurative patterns; even in a tight striped pattern if necessary (echoing the slats of the vertical pergolas in Phoenix) so the interiors of the shelters remain visually accessible from all around. However a canopy of 40 year old widely arching trees would be best of all.

Comment by Rob

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 17:02:10 EDT

Jasper's right: this is just as big a problem at pretty much every station that has bus stops, with perhaps a handful of exceptions. It's a real problem, so I'm glad Matt wrote this piece, but I don't understand why he focused only on Greenbelt.

Comment by H Street Landlord

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:42:24 EDT

Nice write up.

The Phoenix system is quite visually attractive.

Comment by Jasper

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:38:32 EDT

@ Ser AdN:it's less of a problem at Huntington

True. That might be an exception, just like Eisenhower. You have shade from the elevated tracks. But Braddock is pretty open. King St, Van Dorn and College Park have some shade inside the station, but that's too far from the bus stops. At Franconia-Springfield, the pedestrian bridge provides little shelter while the greenery is on a dangerous slope. Vienna and Dunn Loring are brutal as well. The Falls Churches are a bit better.

Comment by Bob Smith

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:28:30 EDT

Good Article. I thought about this last year when we had that string of near 115F temperatures. I wondered if under the extreme conditions, The Bus/WMATA would idle the buses at the bus bay (which they usually do). However, for some reason, the drivers were pulling off to sit in the driveway until departure time. Grr. There could be a cheap fix that would increase customer comfort. Does WMATA even notice these things?

Personally, I think the pedestrian/bike access is a bigger issue at Greenbelt. Greenbelt Metro Drive needs to be repaved desperately and safe places for bikes to be away from potholes, pedestrians, and drivers (and buses!) speed to the terminal. Pedestrians need a safer walkway to the terminal, not dodging cars in the parking lot.

@Jasper - It could happen at all locations, but it is extreme at Greenbelt. Shady Grove East is pretty open, but I was able to find a lone tree.

Comment by Ser Amantio di Nicolao

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:21:46 EDT

@Jasper: In my experience, it's less of a problem at Huntington. For one thing, one of the two bus staging areas is right by the lower entrance to the station, so people can wait just inside and watch for the bus. Also, it's pretty well sheltered there by the elevated tracks, which keeps a lot of the rain off, as do the shelters. The upper area is less well-sheltered, but it's not large, so I doubt it's a huge problem.

That being said, I think a canopy would be the best idea. It's more long-term, and it can shelter more people. Which might encourage more use of the bus lines at the stations in question, no?

Comment by egk

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:20:04 EDT

Eventually the shade trees will grow, but it is really terrible that they weren't planted when the station was built!

Comment by Tina

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:11:24 EDT

Yes!! This problem at Ft. Totten too.

I don't know if the mass of asphalt in the parking lot magnifies the heat or not, - yes.

The transit agency could also replace the transparent roofs on the bus shelters with opaque ones - Or just paint them.

Comment by Jasper

Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:10:25 EDT

Isn't this a problem at most (near) end-of-the line stations, and nearly all bus stops?