I'm a frequent visitor to SF and the Muni bus/trolley-bus/streetcar system is a pleasure to use. The routes are clear, and they run on short headways. DC's bus system, on the other hand, is a mare's nest of route redundancy and confusing route numbers. SF's routes, on the other hand, are named after the principal street on the route. In my neighborhood, I could use the G-2 for my frequent trips to Dupont Circle, but most of the time it's just easier to use the SmartBike, or Metrorail when the weather's bad. During non rush hours, the G-2 only runs every half-hour and the lack of real-time arrival information makes it hard to use. Similarly, the 96 that runs on Florida and New Jersey is almost never on time. All too often the Metrobus system seems to be the mode of last resort.

by Paul on Jan 14, 2009 11:03 am • link • report

Do we have that kind of time? I mean, WMATA has to approve the budget in June to start the new fiscal year on July 1.

In that time period, WMATA would have to come up with ideas, develop them to a level that they can be discussed with the CSOS committee, the FAO committee, the Rider's Advisory Council, and the Board, the Board would have to approve public hearings, take comments, then approve the notional changes.

After that, all the administrative work of remarking the bus stop signage, schedules, reworking bus operator schedules, rescheduling vehicles, etc. has to occur.

I just have a feeling that WMATA is already going to be short on time just to come up with $70+ million in spending cuts without working on a redesign of the bus system.

Maybe I'm too pessimistic.

by Michael Perkins on Jan 14, 2009 11:05 am • link • report

Does anyone know what has happened to a group of people who used to advocate on behalf of bus riders? I know they set up a web site once. It was fairly inactive. Unfortunately I cannot remember the name of it, but I think it had Metro in it. It might have been for the trains too, but I definitely remember that it was also for buses.

This was anywhere from 2-6 years ago.

by Jazzy on Jan 14, 2009 11:17 am • link • report

One other point: many DC bus routes still replicate routes of the long-gone streetcars, and, as much, those might need to evolve to serve newer travel patterns and to address the fact we now have a subway. Why, for example, is there so much service on 7th/Georgia between the Georgia Ave./Petworth Sta. and downtown? The route's been supplanted by the Green Line. Buses on Georgia should serve mainly local travelers. Through passengers should be on the Green Line. Instead Metro is doing the exact opposite and running express buses. Michael Perkins is I think correct in that we should re-invent the bus system, but not expect to have the re-invention in place in time to correct the budget woes. Metrobus has been a fiscal sink-hole for a long time, and we shouldn't expect any quick fixes.

by Paul on Jan 14, 2009 11:21 am • link • report

Yes, please. Cut some bus stops. Like one (just one) of the 2 bus stops BETWEEN 13th and 14th on I on the S bus.

by Chris on Jan 14, 2009 11:23 am • link • report

One way to make the bus system more user-friendly would be to restrict the long-distance buses to a single street, and name the bus after that street. Since DC is in a grid pattern, it would usually be possible to reach any destination using exactly two buses, and to know intuitively what bus one should have to take.

For example, say you're at 37 & O NW and need to get to 7 & H NW. Well, you take the O(North) Bus to 7 & O, and then you take the 7(West) Bus to 7 & H. Only one transfer, and no need for snaking bus lines with meaningless names and obscure paths.

by tom veil on Jan 14, 2009 11:38 am • link • report

They tried (and largely failed) to do this Baltimore a few years back; it was called the GBBI. I'm constantly amazed by the fact that Baltimore has buses running in parallel a block apart over good chunks of the city core. There was huge blowback over it -- basically, every meeting was dominated by little old ladies who were upset that they'd have to walk an extra quarter mile to their stop. The fact that the brain behind it was Ehrlich's sec'y of transportation, who got a deserved reputation as an anti-transit guy, didn't help, as many people saw it as an attempt to cut overall service under the guise of rationalization.

by jfruh on Jan 14, 2009 12:32 pm • link • report

Unfortunately, WMATA and the District are currently proposing to add even more confusing, snakingbus routes - - opposite of what is described on this forum. See: http://dcgetinvolved.com/CirculationStudy/ (use the "December meeting" links). The proposal to add a "Dumbbell Shuttle Route) in Benning Hts (see slide 29 of 34) goes against what is discussed and what would be clear on a map. Just an example.

by Transporter on Jan 14, 2009 12:33 pm • link • report

Jazzy, are you possibly thinking of metroriders.org?

by Michael Perkins on Jan 14, 2009 1:00 pm • link • report

That's it! Thank you.

I see it is rather out-dated. I wonder how much success they ever had. I wish they would update again. I will try to get in touch with them to see what's going on.

by Jazzy on Jan 14, 2009 1:19 pm • link • report

I agree with David, although as Michael points out, I don't know how much can be done between now and when the next budget needs to be developed and passed. Based on my brief viewing of their website, part of what they did in San Francisco was to eliminate routes/parts of routes with low ridership or duplicative service nearby. It seems like a good and easy place for Metro to start.

by DC_Chica on Jan 14, 2009 1:37 pm • link • report

All this talk about elimination is scarey! How much do you all ride the bus?

I ride about 10-12 times a week.

by Jazzy on Jan 14, 2009 1:40 pm • link • report

“basically, every meeting was dominated by little old ladies who were upset that they'd have to walk an extra quarter mile to their stop”

Josh, I understand that many readers here are healthy, have few responsibilities and are under 30, but seriously, an extra quarter mile, especially carrying supplies or purchases, is a big deal for the elderly, for parents traveling with children and for people temporary or permanent disabilities.

And sometimes the routes you describe as snaking are actually based on actual information about transportation needs. Just saying that it is fine to require most people to take two buses for a single trip is not a valid approach to transportation planning.

by Andy on Jan 14, 2009 1:44 pm • link • report

Andy.. the problem is transit is underfunded. Yes, eliminating stops or routes that require people to walk further does affect those who are not healthy enough to walk a nominal distance. However, if you have limited resources the issue here is how do you maximize the net welfare benefit after changes. If you have to cut service, then consolidating routes and cutting stops may result in the smallest ridership drop (as opposed to just cutting service across the board).

by Bus Foamer on Jan 14, 2009 1:54 pm • link • report

Hi Andy-

Yeah, I sort of regreted my too-flip little old lady crack as soon as I made it. To turn it around, though, I'd say that many younger riders actually have needs to be somewhere (i.e. jobs) at fairly specific times that older riders (many retired) don't. A younger person might be willing to walk for an extra five minutes if it makes the difference between 30-minute headways and 15-minute headways, whereas for someone less healthy in less of a rush, the shorter walk is worth the wait.

My objection is not to snaking routes but to obviously redundant routes. For instance, the main bus route downtown near my house is on 10-15 minute headways ... and then there's another downtown bus on 20-minute headways literally a block further east, less than 400 feet away. These two routes run like this for more than two miles -- two of the most densely populated, potentially-transit-friendly miles in the city. It just strikes me as maddeningly inefficient. There's all sorts of stuff like this in the MTA's route system. A quarter mile is the upper limit of how far some routes would need to be moved to really consolidate this stuff well.

jf

by jfruh on Jan 14, 2009 2:05 pm • link • report

And yet...the city is not comprised just of senior citizens and 20 and 30 years olds. There are plenty of people living here in their 40s, 50s and 60s.

How much does everyone ride the bus, on average?

by Jazzy on Jan 14, 2009 2:23 pm • link • report

Duplication may not necessarily be bad. If there are parallel routes, maybe it's because there's high demand in that corridor. You could combine the routes and decrease headway on the new route, sure -- or you could run two routes, a block apart, which combined have the same headway (e.g. two buses with 10 minute headways, staggered = one bus with 5 minute headways). Then it's more convenient for the person a block over, and if you don't want to wait, you have the option to walk to the earlier bus. Plus, by spreading out the routes, you alleviate bottlenecks like lots of riders waiting at the same stop, and spread them out over several stops.

I recognize the problems with this, though: It's hard to get information. The online trip planner only displays three options -- it might not tell you there's an earlier bus a block over. Standing at one stop, you might not know there's an earlier stop a block over. This is complicated if buses don't run on time. So I'm not saying it's perfect -- I'm just making the case for its benefits.

On duplication between Metrorail and buses, there's an argument here, too. Ever found out that your line is closed when you're trying to get home from work? For me, I can take the 38B, the "Orange Line with a view". If we cut redundancy between Metro and buses, there are fewer alternatives when one system fails. Additionally, let's say I'm trying to get from Foggy Bottom to somewhere halfway between Rosslyn and Court House. (Admittedly, my example isn't in the District, but the logic is the same.) I could take Metro one stop and walk half a mile past Rosslyn (uphill); or I could go two stops and walk half a mile back the way I came. Or I could take the 38B, save the time going down and up several escalators, and be dropped off closer to my destination.

I'm not saying there's no value in combining and simplifying routes. But it probably has a more limited role than a wholesale overhaul of the Metrobus route system -- particularly given the questions of political feasibility (as SF and Baltimore point to) and the time constraints in the current budget process. More useful might be to identify the (say) top 20 changes in either cutting/combining routes or in modifying their path to limit spending while minimizing impact on ridership -- and see if we can't make the pain less than an across-the-board cut would be.

by Gavin on Jan 14, 2009 2:46 pm • link • report

jfruh-

are you referring to the 14th and 16th street buses? I can see how frustrating they are north of Irving, but south of Irving, and especially downtown, they serve vastly different populations and are 2 long blocks apart.

Of course you could also be referring to the weekday 68 (64 now?) bus on Sherman fighting the 7th and 11th street buses, it probably should be combined with the 66 (63 now?) bus, there must be some reason for it though, because WMATA just reconfigured it...

by Alex on Jan 14, 2009 3:00 pm • link • report

Another problem with condensing multiple lines onto one street is that residents of that street bear the burden of additional bus noise. Some buses are really loud although their volume seems to be in an inverse relationship with their size; those tiny buses that look like large vans are extremely loud.

by Reid on Jan 14, 2009 3:16 pm • link • report

I don't think Metro will ever be able to run the buses on time, and as you point out, cutting back service only makes things worse. All the more reason we must have accurate NextBus results and have them now.

by John on Jan 14, 2009 3:19 pm • link • report

Jazzy, I used to live in a DC neighborhood only accessible by bus, but now I'm a 15 minute walk to a Metro station. An example I might give as to where bus service could be cut is on the H2/H4 line between Cleveland Park and the Tenleytown/Van Ness stations -- I would be interested to know just how many people ride the bus on that end section of the bus line, and whether it would be burdensome for those who do use it right now to take Metro or another bus to their destination instead. Targeted cuts such as this are a way to save money so that across-the-board cuts don't occur.

by DC_Chica on Jan 14, 2009 3:49 pm • link • report

Gavin -- I honestly think that at headways less than, say, twenty minutes, there's no point in keeping a set schedule, because in my experience buses never keep to it. It would be one thing if you had two parallel routes and you could know when the buses were going to be at any given stop, but that almost never happens. Instead, you usually know "this bus comes about every fifteen minutes, on average." That's the fatal flaw in the two-parallel-routes theory.

Alex -- I'm actually writing from Baltimore, sorry, should have made that clear. (For the record, I'm talking about the 11 on Charles/Maryland and the 3 on St. Paul between 33rd and Eager, if that means anything to anybody.)

by jfruh on Jan 14, 2009 3:54 pm • link • report

Paul-

About the 7th Street buses:

1) The express buses (79s) that run downtown leave from Silver Spring station. They avoid people leaving from there to have to transfer to a green line train (yellows don't run during rush hour).

2) Have you seen how many people are on the 7th Street buses? MANY. The plain fact is that for some people, Metro is too expensive.

Think of it like this: taking the green line from Petworth to Gallery place costs $3.30/day. The bus costs $2.50/day. A savings of $4 a week. If you have an $11 unlimited bus pass (which many people do), you're saving at least $5.50. The passes are even good on the $3 express routes and any other bus routes they make take, which makes the cost savings even more significant.

3) Thanks to the diversion of the green line to Columbia Heights, there is a large area along Georgia Avenue between the Petworth station and Shaw station (which runs by major institutions such as the Washington Hospital Center and Howard U) that are not as Metro-accessible, especially for the elderly.

by Adam on Jan 14, 2009 5:32 pm • link • report

For parallel routes, how about making one a "major" route (running every 15 minutes or more frequently) and one a "minor" route (running every hour or so, maybe). Put signs up along the minor route explaining what is going on, so that people can walk to the major route if they care to, but not if they don't (or can't).

I encountered something like this on a bus route in Toronto. At the end of the route, most buses looped around one way, but a few looped around a different way. (I have no idea why.) I found myself at one of the infrequently served stops, and the route information sign said pretty clearly, "This is not the main stop for the (Whatever) Street bus. For more frequent service, cross the street and go one block north." At least, it was clear enough that I, a tourist with no prior knowledge of Toronto buses, was able to figure out what was going on. And this was well outside the part of town frequented by tourists, too.

by Johanna on Jan 14, 2009 6:12 pm • link • report

There aren't many parallel routes as opined about in the initial post. E.g., you can't consider the 14th and the 16th Street buses duplicative. There are opportunities for rationalizing bus service within those lines, and in places where there is a fair amount of duplication at certain times. Other than that, at least with the major routes (30s, 70s, 90s, X2, S, 50s) you don't have those opportunities.

by Richard Layman on Jan 14, 2009 6:41 pm • link • report

Adam, are the bus passes good for unlimited express buses, or just a $1.25 discount on those buses? I think it's the latter. Still, the bus pass is a fantastic deal. Once the passes work on Smartrip, I think a good policy would be for the pass to be worth a discount on rail travel (maybe a full $1.25, maybe just equivalent to a bus transfer), but it's not going to happen in this financial environment.

by Michael Perkins on Jan 14, 2009 6:53 pm • link • report

Flash passes Adam was talking about are good for unlimited buses period. Good luck getting it on Smart Trip! It's something you have to go to Metro Center or an authorized store to buy.

I seriously doubt they'd ever get put on Smart Trip. I have used them a lot. I haven't seen hordes of young people using them, though, as they do not lend themselves to electronic ease of use. You have to go somewhere to buy it and so on. They're the best. So of course I expect to see a blog entry advocating that they be abolished as a big money waster.

Kidding - sort of. not. Yes I am!

by Jazzy on Jan 14, 2009 7:29 pm • link • report

I'd like to thank David for mentioning me in this post.

David said, Today, I believe our bus routes are over-optimized. The problem is not that the routes are over-optimized, the problem is that they are optimized in isolation. Optimizing a system piece-by-piece can produce an overall suboptimal system. That's why we need to look at it as a whole, as SF has done. This process can take 2 years just to gather the data and do the evaluations. Metro did a Regional Bus Study, but the only results taken from it have been the list of corridors for rapid buses. It has continued to do things piecemeal, the current study of the D-series buses is a case in point. The focus is so narrow that the G2, which runs one or two blocks away is not included.

In the short-run, none of that can be done. Low-producing routes have to be cut or consolidated. Low ridership segments can be detached from their source lines and use smaller vehicles with larger headways. I have seen near-empty 70s running their circuitous loop south of M St. Wouldn't it make more sense to detach this segment and reduce its service? Costs would fall. Sure, some people will be inconvenienced by an extra transfer, but is it worth running excessive service just to avoid these transfers? The reliability of the 70 and 71 would improve, so the connection could be timed.

by Chuck Coleman on Jan 14, 2009 8:36 pm • link • report

According to WMATA, they're worth $1.25 off of the $3 fare for an express bus:

http://wmata.com/fares/purchase/store/

If there are express bus drivers that give free rides with a flash pass, it's not WMATA policy, it's just a driver that's doing people a favor.

As far as getting it on Smartrip, it's in the contract between WMATA and Cubic to deliver such an upgrade by third quarter 2009, according to this presentation before the Riders Advisory Council:

http://www.wmata.com/about_metro/riders_advisory_council/minutes/docs/SmarTrip%20Presentation,%20Adobe.pdf

The upgrade should include pass subscriptions, automatic renewals, etc.

And on the contrary to what your post implies, I think the bus passes are great and the rail passes should be priced with the same philosophy in mind as the bus passes. The bus passes are priced below the price of 10 rides, making them a good deal for twice daily commuters. The rail passes are not really priced below the price of 10 rides (except really long rides!), making them somewhat of a lousy deal for commuters. They're also inconvenient in that they don't work with Smartrip. With the new changes to how employee transit benefits are distributed through Smartbenefits, it's not even clear you'll be able to buy them anymore with your transit benefit, either (you may be able to take vouchers weekly to the window at Metro Center, but that's really inconvenient).

My philosophy on passes is, if you can convert a pay-per-ride pricing system, where people have to trade off the cost of riding transit with driving or taxi or whatever for each ride, if you can trade that off for a unlimited monthly or weekly benefit, where transit is free but driving or taxi costs each ride, that's going to encourage people to take transit. That's why I like priced parking, pay-per-mile insurance, and roads funded through gas taxes as opposed to general revenues like sales taxes or property taxes. I'd rather have all-you-can-eat transit pricing and pay-per-mile driving, than all-you-can-eat driving and pay-per-ride transit.

So you won't get such a blog post (about how bus passes are a waste) coming from me. Bring on the bus passes!

by Michael Perkins on Jan 14, 2009 8:50 pm • link • report

Good to know! Thanks. I'll try to hold you to it.

Apologies for this long posting.

The Ride Guide. No, it’s not the best thing that ever was, but they’ve made some improvements and it’s a little better now, and I for one use it all the time, and find it extremely helpful. There are ways to use it to sweep any and all available nearby buses into the search. Just play with it some.

I haven’t come across many if any parallel routes either. Some intersect sure, but that’s ok, because then they veer apart again.

What really needs to improve are the fundamentals. MetroBus needs to work five thousand times harder at arriving and departing ON TIME. Unreliability is to my mind just the biggest problem. It doesn’t involve studies, or fancy jargon, just nailing the fundamentals day in and day out. Too often, things are just allowed to slide, and it’s just not enough of a big deal, and it should be. This is why I was hoping there was some active group like Metro Riders, but I think they’re defunct, and I’m not sure how effective they were, but bless them for trying.

My point is, all these cool streamlined changes can be made, and some of them need to be, sure, but until something SERIOUS is in place to increase if not guarantee reliability– maybe dedicated bus lanes, maybe the ability to manipulate traffic lights, maybe SELECTIVELY reducing stops – then nothing will change, not really.

The trend has been to cut bus service. I’ve heard the budget for transit is balanced on the backs of bus riders. Many people on this blog are for increasing rail service but cutting bus service! How does this help a pedestrian’s cause?? Especially cutting out bus service at night.

It does not make sense to me, and indeed strikes me as unfair. (See the whole discussion about getting rid of the bus transfers. Real live human beings need these things!)

I second everyone’s comments who spoke up in favor of increasing support for buses.

As to this comment

"Jazzy, I used to live in a DC neighborhood only accessible by bus, but now I'm a 15 minute walk to a Metro station. An example I might give as to where bus service could be cut is on the H2/H4 line between Cleveland Park and the Tenleytown/Van Ness stations -- I would be interested to know just how many people ride the bus on that end section of the bus line, and whether it would be burdensome for those who do use it right now to take Metro or another bus to their destination instead. Targeted cuts such as this are a way to save money so that across-the-board cuts don't occur."

I honestly do not know how many people ride the h lines between Cleveland Park and T’town stations, but I do know if I did, and they cut it, I would not take a metro then a bus or a metro and a bus.

The metrorail system is not extensive enough now to be cutting as much bus service as has been done so, and continues to be done.

by Jazzy on Jan 14, 2009 9:08 pm • link • report

Jazzy: As long as you don't hold me to it permanently. I reserve the right to call for an increase in the bus pass price if the regular bus pass increases in price, it won't be because it's "wasteful", it'll be because the cost of providing bus services has gone up and to keep the pass price the same while the fare goes up doesn't make sense. As long as WMATA keeps the pass price below 10 rides, I'm happy.

by Michael Perkins on Jan 14, 2009 10:12 pm • link • report

No examples. Just rationalizations. The 14th and 16th Street lines are a good example. Both well used, but just two blocks apart with very different riders. David doesn't know the bus routes, much as he often doesn't understand driving in the District.

by Rich on Jan 14, 2009 11:59 pm • link • report

Im looking at WMATA's DC bus map and some old bus schedules and they have basically brought back

a bunch of the old routes that were shorten or discontinued.

90,92

used to be 90,91,92,93

90 & 92 had same routes but went to McLean Gardens

91 went from McLean Gardens to Congress Hgts before the station was built. Went same basic routes except it turned on Penn Ave traveling north then 1st Street, around Union Station up North Capitol Street to Florida Ave made a left and continued to McLean gardens

93 was discontinued and brought back.

31,32,34,36,37,39

use to be 30,32,34,35,36

The combining of these routes backfired on them because I recall the discontinuing a 34 bus route and that becoming a M5 going about 1/5 of the pervious route and come 2-3 months later its back to 34 and going about half of its orginal route. Most of the 32, 36 buses from SE are packed worst than before.

70,71, 79

use to be 70,71, 73. 73 was basically the same but the route branched off somewhere near Walter Reed and went somewhere else.

Extend 70 to take 71 portion, have 79 take over for 71

80

used to be 80,81

81 was basically the same as the 80 but went between Fort Totten and Mcpherson Sq.

S1,S2,S4

Why not extend the S1 to Silver Spring take over the S4 portion extend on southern end to Kennedy Center keep S2 the same.

96,97,D6,42

about 16 years ago there was the 96, 40, 44,

96 went from Stadium Armory to U Street Station

40 was the current 97 route but ran all the time.

44 was basically the 40 route plus the D6 plus the 42 and went from Capitol Hgts to Mt. Pleasant.

W6,W8 They are the same route one running clock wise and the other counted clockwise why not split them to better serve the area.

X1,X2,X3/U8 First it was the X1,X2,X3,X4

X1 current route

X2 went from Capitol Hgts to Lafayette Sq.

X3 current route

X4 went from Benning Hgts to Lafayette Sq.

Replaced the X2 portion from Minnesota Ave to Capitol Hgts and the X4 from Benning Road & Minnesota Ave to Benning Hgts with the U8 and U9 discontinued the U9 a few years later.

X1 and X3 were discontinued and were brought back about 10 years later.

52,53,54 They have basically gone back to the route they had 20 years ago expect that the

50 traveled the current 52 route and went to the Bureau of Engraving

52 traveled the current 54 route to Independence ave and went to Navy Yard Penn Ave and 8th Street SE

54 was basically the same

60,62,63,64, Serious WTF they split the 60 & 64 routes in half back when Georgia Ave & Columbia Hgts stations opened and now its back to the orginal route

E2,E3,E4 Couldnt we drop one of them and reroute one of the others up Oregon Ave, Chestnut Street, Western Ave and Broadbranch Rd and replace the E6

B8.B9 combine both routes

L1,L2,L4 drop the L4 and run the L1 all the time and have it go to Potomac Park during rush hour and run more buses

Those are the only routes I see close to having anything parrlel

and most are traveling on main streets then branching off and going

seperate places.

Maybe running a seperate route from where the bus routes branch off and connect

those parts as a line and then the portion they travel thats the same thats another route.

As for the long routes most people dont ride from one end to the other take the 70's or the 30's most are riding from one spot inbetween to one end of the line etc. not from one end to the other and most of those are the old street car lines 30's 70's 90's

Lots of people cant afford the rail fare so bus is the only option. The bus fare has gone up about 25 cents over the past 16 years while the rail has gone up alot more.

WMATA use to have a Bus and Rail Pass I dont remember how much it was but it was a better value than anything they have now. Whenever WMATA gets the smartrip situation together maybe they could bring it back.

@ Jazzy couldnt they just reroute the N8 have that go down Conn. Ave to Porter Street then up

Wisconsin Ave to its current route. Have the H2 go its route turn left on Van Ness Street and continue to Tenleytown station drop the H3, have either the H2 or 4 skip the hospitals

by KK on Jan 15, 2009 12:04 am • link • report

re passes, I meant doing away with them altogether (not doing so!) like what happened with the paper transfers....

K, the bus passes are $11, last time I bought one. It's called a flash pass. Good for one week, unlimited rides, well not express buses.

by Jazzy on Jan 15, 2009 7:41 am • link • report

K, quite impressive knowledge of the bus system!

Regarding cross town routes, and people only riding a part of the way. Whenver I had to go cross town, when I didn't have a car, I would take the bus over the metro. I'd allow myself more time, lots of time. It's a GREAT way to sight see and get exposed to a totally different area of town. However yes, they take a really long time. Does running cross town express buses make sense I wonder? Probably not, as I'm guessing there's not a high demand, but it'd be cool, in fantasyland.

by Jazzy on Jan 15, 2009 7:54 am • link • report

Not to belabor the point, but the $11 unlimited bus passes are available online and from social service agencies (not just from Metro sales offices) including the $6 reduced passes for the elderly and disabled.

by Adam on Jan 15, 2009 1:19 pm • link • report