Comments on Could Capital Strollershare work? - Greater Greater Washington

Comment by Alex B.

Wed, 29 Aug 2012 13:57:14 EDT

Stroller rental, I can see. Working out the details would be tricky, as the places that have it now are often closed environments (e.g. an amusement park), not open ones like a city.

Stroller share? As in the same format as Bikeshare? I have more trouble seeing this.

For one, the universe of potential users is much smaller. You're only talking about parents with kids, and even then, only a subset of parents would use them - those that need a stroller full-time (e.g. for a kid that can't walk or an infant) wouldn't likely be able to make use of a shared system, since they'd have to start and end all their trips already with a stroller.

Two, the purpose of a shared system is to use the bike for a short trip and then return it for use by someone else. The system is inherently limited to the area of coverage it has, thus any strollershare would need to have a fairly wide range of coverage (e.g. a lot of stations), and that's a large capital investment for a little benefit (the aformentioned small universe of potential users).

I just don't see it working, and not due to the logistics of cleaning, either. I just don't see how that model applies.

What might work would be straight-up stroller rental (Bike n Roll style) or a membership-based, return to its home kind of service like Zipcar is (where each stroller would have a set parking space).

The idea of strollershare is a nice statement of the problem, but I don't think this idea comes anywhere near a solution.

Comment by Ken Archer

Wed, 29 Aug 2012 13:18:49 EDT

I am liking the idea of a hard, plastic base, and parents bring their own fabric covering.

Not only does this solve the cleanliness issue, but a challenge with strollers is the easiest ones to transport - umbrella strollers - are the hardest for kids to nap in because they don't have hard backs (and don't recline).

The stroller stations could be really small, as collapsed strollers take up less space than bikes.

Comment by oboe

Tue, 28 Aug 2012 14:36:48 EDT

Needing all-terrain for a sidewalk is maybe a signal that we need better maintained sidewalks.

Sure, but we do need better maintained sidewalks. So it's both a signal and a solution. :)

Comment by Matthew

Tue, 28 Aug 2012 14:31:35 EDT

There's just one big difference between bike share and stroller share... children are messy and they are often sick... do you really want your child sitting in a stroller that God knows how many other kids have drooled, slobbered, and possibly even messed their diaper in? I mean really, that's just sick, you don't know what you'd be putting your baby into. Even if a crew comes along to clean them periodically I'd still be worried about putting my child into something filthy.

Comment by Falls Church

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 23:39:27 EDT

Another idea to solve the padding/sanitation issue is to have a hard plastic base and an air-filled vinyl top layer that is water/pee/stain proof. Kind of like inflatable furniture or an inflatable sleeping pad one uses when camping. The top layer could be replaced periodically at a relatively low cost without replacing the rest of the stroller apparatus.

Comment by Falls Church

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 23:28:16 EDT

Steve Jobs once said that if you asked a focus group to come up with an iPod, they would have told you they were perfectly happy with their Walkmen. This comment thread sounds an awful lot like that kind of focus group. It also sounds like what everyone said about bikeshare before it started -- solution in search of a problem, etc.

I don't know how successful a stroller share would be but its an intriguing idea. Yes, the sanitation issue is significant, so some thoughtful design would have to go into solving that problem (perhaps, a hard plastic stroller and renters are responsible for carrying around their own soft padding, much like bikeshare renters have to carry around their own helmets?). But, none of the problems mentioned on the thread are unsolvable from a design/engineering standpoint. The fact that stroller rentals do exist in some situations -- like at Bike and Roll, amusements parks, malls, and airports -- suggests there is underlying demand. Remember when people said there's no need for bikeshare because you can rent a bike from Bike and Roll?

While I don't have a stroller, I am someone who regularly transports my bike on metro, so I face similar hassles to people navigating strollers through the metro system. I certainly use bikeshare sometimes to avoid the hassle of bringing my bike on metro, so I can imagine stroller users may do so likewise with stroller-share.

Comment by Ms. D

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 23:09:13 EDT

Sorry, Pat, but you deserve the dirty look if you're truly taking up *6* square feet with a stroller. My largest suitcase (which is HUGE, I have to be careful to keep it under 70 lbs. for international travel, because it will easily hold 100+ lbs of stuff, and I don't take that one on the Metro), takes up well under *2* square feet of floor space. This, once again, is my complaint. We're not talking about 2-year-olds in umbrella strollers, we're talking about people taking up the space of 3, 4, 5, or more full-grown adults to cart their old-enough-to-walk kids around in SUV-size strollers (5, 6, or even older...the biggest strollers - again, seen many of them on Metro - can hold *2* average *6* year olds). That's just insanity, and, yes, it's rude to fellow riders. Kids 5 and older are supposed to pay to ride the Metro. If your kid is old enough to pay and not disabled, they should be walking. If your kid is younger and you're traveling a long distance, an umbrella stroller is fine (5 seconds on Google netted me a result of one that will hold a kid up to 40 lbs and takes up under 3 square feet of floor space).

But just like people with bikes and suitcases and guitars, it's appropriate to ask for common courtesy. Stay towards the ends of the trains (where you're likely to get newer cars with more open floor space...the first and last two cars are usually good bets) and cars (where you can use the extra floor space in newer cars or otherwise get the stroller out of tripping range of *most* people who need to get on and off). Try to travel at lower-volume times (fringes of rush hour and off-peak...I find it hard to believe that every single employer I've had was A-okay with parents calling off or late all the time because of their kids but that there are no employers out there who are willing to let parents start work a little early or late to avoid the heart of rush hour). If your kid isn't in the stroller or the train is REALLY crowded, fold it up (I get that it can be awkward to do so and then board a bus, but getting *on* the train, seating the kid, and *then* collapsing the stroller, and popping it open and putting them back in it just before exiting doesn't seem like too much of an inconvenience *when the train is very crowded*...particularly if there are multiple adults handling one child). Use the elevators. Try not to block the doors, and if you get stuck in front of a door, accomodate people getting on and off. I do these things any time I have to travel with luggage or other items that I know will be in people's way, and I just don't find it that hard to do. Most people in wheelchairs seem to be able to pull off not being super-obstructive.

But I do think that the Smithsonian or NPS could also pull off stroller rental. Zoos, amusement parks, and other attractions do it. Outside of extreme incompetence, there's no reason NPS couldn't, also. And if they can't, yes, services like Bike and Roll's can do it just slightly off of the Mall.

Comment by Rich

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 15:36:40 EDT

@Gray: A few weeks ago, I saw a couple where baby (not a newborn) was in a snuggly (remember those). I wanted to congratulate them for not having some SUV contraption that would be impractical even in the suburbs. It looks like some makers of strollers have tried to slim them down while allowing parents to strap on all their crap (which often is the main reason for the stroller) without using too much space. I saw something like this in Central park over the weekend. I should have taken a picture.

The history buff in me likes to note that families, often very big families were raised in the most densely populated sections of DC and other cities, and not that long ago. Somehow, people have managed and the impediments to urbanization and family life are probably more routed in imagination than in fact.

Comment by CityBeautiful21

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 15:36:11 EDT

The sanitation issue is too big a barrier. Even the most well-tended-to kids eventually have some bodily fluid event that makes the stroller gross. Parents will clean their own kids' stroller because they have to put their own kid in it again. Stroller-share would unplug this incentive dynamic to keep the equipment clean.

WMATA could still do more on the stroller issue by promoting umbrella strollers more heavily in their advertisements and website to:

1. Encourage parents to get strollers that work best for everyone on transit.

2. Encourage churlish types to understand that public transportation is for all members of the public, including those too young to walk significant distances, climb stairs, or make safety-conscious decisions about crossing streets.

Comment by drumz

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 13:49:34 EDT

Also I saw an ad or commercial for a special "all terrain" stroller that was huge and proceeded to be shown used exclusively on sidewalks. Needing all-terrain for a sidewalk is maybe a signal that we need better maintained sidewalks.

Comment by Karl

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 13:38:16 EDT

Where is Lydia DePillis when we need her? This is her kind of story! A ridiculous idea that needs her special brand of ridicule.

Comment by Gray

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 13:11:08 EDT

Or parents could just manage to use strollers that don't take up the space of six people. Would that be so hard?

Comment by Ken Archer

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 13:03:12 EDT

I would use this service with my 3-year-old for longer trips, and make fewer car trips as a result, particularly if the stroller had a reclinable seat-back so my son could nap in the stroller.

The Smithsonian already offers stroller rental at the National Zoo.

If parents insist on someone cleaning the strollers between uses, then this wouldn't work. I don't know if the Zoo does cleaning between uses. You could possibly use strollers with no fabric and even have wet-wipes at stroller-share stations.

Comment by Gavin

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:54:47 EDT

Sorry, but in Montréal it'd have to be "Bixi Bébé".

Comment by Simon

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:48:13 EDT

If you really want to solve an _actual_ problem (instead of a made-up one): cheap-o long-term stroller rentals at airports subsidized by the airlines, thus obviating the need to check one's own stroller through the airline (which they usually don't charge for and thus aren't making any money off of).

Comment by Pat

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:37:09 EDT

I don't see any point to this. I have to mimic the "am I reading the Onion?" sentiment. As a parent, I would rather have my son's stroller on the bus or train than have to lug him and all his toddler stuff around without one. Why would I trade our own stroller for a rented one? And as for the dirty looks I get from hipsters for taking up an extra six square feet of a train, I could care less. It's no different from a suitcase, wheelchair, bike, or guitar. Who cares?

Comment by Steve

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:35:35 EDT

Interesting thought. For the sanitation aspect, how about making it so you had to buy a seat cover in essence that was easily rolled up and transportable. Without the seat "cover", the device would not be usable somehow so that it was just a frame that the seat cover snapped onto. Perhaps this could avoid the sanity issue. For musical instruments and diving rentals, people buy their own mouth pieces. So think of something comparable for this service.

Comment by Jamie

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:21:19 EDT

Whether or not it applies, the use of "nanny state" in the context of stroller rentals just adds to the overall feeling that I am reading The Onion on this one...

This seems like a solution in search of a problem. Sure, having a child could be more convenient. Sure, people without kids get annoyed by children. Welcome to life.... are any of these problems that really require an entire new citywide infrastructure to cope with? That could possibly be done well enough, comprehensively enough, that you could really leave home without a stroller (if you weren't going to anyway)?

I think we can live without this one.

Comment by Simon

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:19:37 EDT

The biggest problem is that strollers are "soft" -- i.e. made mostly of fabric -- whereas a bike has very little "soft" (just the seat, and I'd be interested to learn how long a CaBi seat lasts).

Go to a grocery store and look at the carts with the baby seat permanently attached -- they're made of hard plastic -- OK for a half-hour grocery shopping trip but I wouldn't want to wheel my baby around all day in that.

Comment by Thayer-D

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:12:17 EDT

@ CMC,
No, it's not a problem, and I take back my nanny state wording.

Comment by Arl Fan

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:11:22 EDT

"too nanny state"? Not sure I see that here, or the likelihood of it (doubtful this would lead to, e.g., a requirement that all parents use a stroller to take their kids on the Mall).

Sounds like the sanitation/cleaning issue is the biggest problem. Could it be solved with some sort of a cover? Get one free along with your key fob when you buy an annual membership; otherwise they'd be available from certain locations / vendors / vending machines? Publish the specs so that the street vendors could offer them with "FBI", "CIA", or Bart Simpson mud flap designs?

Comment by Jasper

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 12:10:53 EDT

If everybody would just chill out, this problem would not exist.

Comment by cmc

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 11:56:46 EDT

@Thayer-D,
It is a "nanny state" problem if a private company offers to solve a problem for a consumer at a cost? That term is thrown around too loosely.

Comment by dcparker

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 11:55:07 EDT

I worked the stroller rental at an amusement park for part of one summer. Between uses we would hose the strollers down with a mix of hot water and some sort of mystery cleaning fluid (most likely pure bleach given how cheap the owners of the park were).

The combination of spilled juice, stray Cheerios, and bodily waste is something I still smell in my nightmares.

Comment by Thayer-D

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 11:49:38 EDT

Matt C +1,
Strollers are nasty, as anyone who has dealt with them can attest. I'd also add that when people take their kids in public, they are 100% responsible for their needs, so this seems a bit too nanny state for my taste. On the other hand, if I ever saw someone complain that a parent was taking too much space with their baby, I might have some choice words for that person. Wether way young or really old, everyone in our society needs to be respected, with or without laws.

Comment by drumz

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 11:34:09 EDT

Isn't this kind of what they do in shopping malls/airports?

Comment by Matt C

Mon, 27 Aug 2012 11:29:09 EDT

Sanitation is the barrier here. Has anyone invented a stroller you can hose down after use? Babies and young children both spread and catch diseases more frequently than adults. Also, strollers don't stay clean long.

PS. Last sentence is incomplete.