Link is missing for Milloy piece.

But code words or not can we all agree that his arguments are just dumb on their face no matter their intent?

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 9:11 am • link • report

Why not red, white, and blue? It'd be fitting for our nation's capital.
The thumbnail design looks somewhat like the Spanish flag's colors, and the green and yellow design looked like Brazil's.

by m2fc on Dec 12, 2012 9:12 am • link • report

drumz: I've fixed the link. Thanks.

by David Alpert on Dec 12, 2012 9:15 am • link • report

So now the Post is openly publishing conspiracy theories. If you're going to claim there is a Plan, you should actually have some evidence of it - like a confession or a document entitled "The Plan". In fact, Milloy concedes that what he is calling The Plan doesn't even match up with The Plan conspiracy theory.

"The Plan is real!"
"But The Plan involves white people kicking out black people. That's not what this is."
"And yet it is still The Plan."

Just when you think Milloy has hit bottom, he somehow manages to go lower. Bravo sir. Bravo. I can assure you, I over-estimated you for the last time.

by David C on Dec 12, 2012 9:17 am • link • report

On the train from Norfolk now. Just getting into Old Town.

by Froggie on Dec 12, 2012 9:17 am • link • report

Union Station developers wanted a depot to keep buses that bring tourists to and from the station so merchants could sell fast food and souvenirs.

Yes, the hordes of tourists from philadelphia and NYC coming on megabus to our town, to eat our mcdonalds, and our Au Bon Pain should stay in their own cities. We all know the only way to truly travel to DC is by charging down 295 at 80mph because that shows you care about DC's poor residents.

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 9:23 am • link • report

Today I learned that Mayor Gray is an Uncle Tom and that 12 year old kids from Ivy City care about job training and hate bike lanes. Thanks Courtland Milloy for your wonderful journalism!

by Teyo on Dec 12, 2012 9:28 am • link • report

CM is the dead-tree version of a troll. Dont feed the troll!

by SJE on Dec 12, 2012 9:37 am • link • report

"Most of the money is being spent on bike lanes when we could use it over here for job training."

Yeah, DC is just throwing all of its money at bike lanes instead of at things that actually help people!

This seems like the same kind of misinformation that makes people think the Federal Government spends 45% of its budget on "foreign aid."

Reality check:
The district spend $600 million (5% of the DC budget) on "public works" in FY2012. About HALF of that is the WMATA subsidy, and the rest is split about evenly between DDOT, DPW, and DDOE/other. So I'll round up - the entirety of DDOT got 1% of the budget. That's for everything they do; roads, circulator (I think), bike lanes, etc.

Public Education got 17% of the budget. That's mostly schools (DCPS/Charter/UDC/Special Ed Transportation) but also libraries.

Human Services got 33% of the budget. That's DHS, Mental health, parks, DYRS, etc.

The idea that we are just throwing money at bike lanes to the expense of ANYTHING else is ridiculous.

by MLD on Dec 12, 2012 9:38 am • link • report

Councilmembers hate taxi colors

Beuh. Nanny-state policy. Why are elected officials involved in the house-colors of private business? What's next? A rules that McD needs to make it's colors brown and green?

by Jasper on Dec 12, 2012 9:45 am • link • report

The Ivy City bus yard is a terrible idea for many reasons and I am glad it has been stopped. But Milloy's column is ridiculous. As for the City spending "most of its money" on bike lanes, I will let it pass since the kid is 12. Of course, I would argue that one way to improve Ivy City would be to put its major thoroughfares on a road diet. West Virginia Avenue, Mount Olivet Road and Bladensburg Road are high-speed boulevards full of suburban commuters and trucks that already create considerable air quality and noise pollution problems. Wider sidewalks, healthy street trees with large planting areas and bike lanes on those streets would do wonders for the health and safety of Ivy City residents. Would Milloy be willing to sacrifice car space to improve the health of Ivy City residents? Speaking of suburban commuters, am I to understand that Milloy's car cleans the air during his long commute from the far reaches of Prince George's County to the Post via several low-income DC neighborhoods? If so, where does one get one of these magical cars? Given Milloy's selfless concern for the welfare of DC's poor and the preponderance of evidence that childhood asthma in DC is largely the result of automobile tailpipe emissions and , is Milloy willing to cut back on his driving?

by rg on Dec 12, 2012 9:45 am • link • report

Grade-A trollery. I mean, really high quality stuff. If pageviews is what the Post is after, they've hit upon a real gold mine.

I look forward to the next column, which will posit that The Protocols of the Elders of Zion are even more dastardly than we thought.

by Dizzy on Dec 12, 2012 9:45 am • link • report

Milloy is so ridiculously infuriating that I actually look forward to his columns. He hit all the main points: The Plan, rich white people, poor black people, dog parks and bike lanes. Bravo. GGW or maybe the City Paper should have a CM column parody contest. That would be a hoot.

by spookiness on Dec 12, 2012 9:56 am • link • report

The other element of MLD's point is that most of the money we spend on bike lanes is federal transportation money that is set aside for walking and biking. It's not 100% fungible and can't be redirected to job training.

by David C on Dec 12, 2012 9:57 am • link • report

With the Pennsylvania Ave cycle track rebuilt, MPD will enforce the no U-turn law.

This should be easy for them - they're usually parked in the middle of the cycletrack anyways.

by Jeff on Dec 12, 2012 9:57 am • link • report

Wider sidewalks, healthy street trees with large planting areas and bike lanes on those streets would do wonders for the health and safety of Ivy City residents.

I think @rg hits it right on the head. CM isn't interested in the health and welfare of the residents of Ivy City, he's only interested in his own welfare as a suburban commuter.

by dc denizen on Dec 12, 2012 9:59 am • link • report

I would read Milloy's piece, but I'm busy chasing poor people out of the District by filling their neighborhoods with carcinogens that will linger for decades, after which I will immediately move into the houses they've vacated. Truly, my evil plan is flawless!

by cminus on Dec 12, 2012 10:03 am • link • report

Helpful quotes from Ben Harris last week!

"The District's FY2012 budget allocated $126 million to the Department of Employment Services (DOES). DOES' purview includes programs such as adult workforce programs, transitional employment, local job training and the controversial Summer Youth Employment Program (SYEP).

Many of these programs fall within the Workforce Development division, which 'provides employment-related services for unemployed or underemployed persons so that they can achieve economic security.' Workforce Development alone saw more than $55 million in the FY2012 budget."

http://cfo.dc.gov/node/289642

"According to the [District's Master Bicycle Plan], the total cost of construction and signage of all new bike routes and lanes between 2005-2015, which encompasses well over 100 miles of routes and lanes both east and west of the Anacostia, is only $420,000."

http://ddot.dc.gov/DC/DDOT/On+Your+Street/Bicycles+and+Pedestrians/Bicycles/Bicycle+Master+Plan/DC+Bicycle+Master+Plan+-+April+2005

From Milloy, today: "Demarco Jones, 12, said: 'Most of the money is being spent on bike lanes when we could use it over here for job training.'"

A 12-year-old can be forgiven for not knowing better, especially since he probably gets that impression from adults. Those adults, however, SHOULD know better. Milloy goes out of his way to spread these untruths for the sake of riling up people he doesn't like. "The Plan"? Come on. Why that hack still has a job is beyond me.

by CapHill on Dec 12, 2012 10:08 am • link • report

Re: Milloy's column. How much do you want to bet that the quote from the 12 year old actually went down something like this?
Milloy: Hey there young fella, don't you think that the city cares more about bike lanes than job training?
Kid:(barely paying attention to old man talking) Uhh, yeah.
Milloy: what a bright young man. Look out for your quote in my next column!

by I. Rex on Dec 12, 2012 10:31 am • link • report

Dat [deleted] Milloy don't even stay in DC!

by B. Jones on Dec 12, 2012 10:39 am • link • report

Wait. So, CM is happy with the current state of Ivy City? It's one of the most shockingly impoverished neighborhoods on the entire East Coast.

Yes, improvements to the neighborhood will bring gentrification and newcomers. For a neighborhood that's got an incredibly high vacancy rate (and lots of empty lots), however, it's going to take a long time for existing residents to be pushed out. Even then, that can be mitigated, and the development of the neighborhood will also likely bring jobs along with it.

I'm completely in support of supporting our poorest residents. However, neighborhoods like Ivy City represent a perpetual cycle of deep poverty. Leaving things as they are would imply that everything's fine in Ivy City -- I'm really just not sure how you could visit the neighborhood and make that claim.

(Oh, but the bus depot was a bad idea, so it's good that it got nixed.)

by andrew on Dec 12, 2012 10:41 am • link • report

It's good to see 12 year old Demarco Jones already thinking about what field he'd like to go into!

Any guess about the lead in to Demarco's comments?

by thump on Dec 12, 2012 10:43 am • link • report

It's kind of rich that Courtland Milloy now rails against gentrification when he long ago cashed in on it and moved to PG County. Apparently that was no problem for him, but yet he claims it would be a grievous harm to current DC residents.

Incidentally, I would be very interested to see if Milloy is currently registered to vote in DC.

by Phil on Dec 12, 2012 10:49 am • link • report

To quote Milloy:

Union Station developers wanted a depot to keep buses that bring tourists to and from the station so merchants could sell fast food and souvenirs. Investors wanted to make a profit, city officials more tax dollars — for more bike lanes and dog parks, no doubt.

Next time, could we just have the 12 year old write the entire article. It would be more coherent and informative than Milloy's usual stuff.

by oboe on Dec 12, 2012 10:55 am • link • report

I wonder if taxi colors are part of The Plan

by SJE on Dec 12, 2012 11:02 am • link • report

Patrick Mara just announced on Newstalk with Bruce DePuyt that he's running in the at-large special election.

Probably a shoo-in.

by Tom Coumaris on Dec 12, 2012 11:14 am • link • report

Milloy uses vulnerable people like a human shield for promoting his personal agenda.

by Tina on Dec 12, 2012 11:16 am • link • report

Say what you will about Courtland Milloy - or anyone else who points out the obvious.

You can't blame Ivy City for for not wanting a bus depot. If having a bus depot was such a good thing, those who like to trash Mr. Milloy would welcome a bus depot in THEIR neighborhoods.

by ceefer66 on Dec 12, 2012 11:37 am • link • report

He insists the city cares more about bike lanes than job training because a 12 year old says so.

Care to post some real facts or do opinions here answer the day? Thankfully, I read the article before reading about it here. Even then, I wondered how in the world does a 12-yr old have the wherewithall to discern what the city spends its money on in the first place. But to suggest that Milloy "insists" this because a 12-yr old say so rests at the height of journalistic shenanigans gone rouge. Once again, we're showing the rest of DC how insanely preoccupied w/characterizing the "enemy."

Last week the complaint was that people could read his mind and know when he's playing the race card. Today, well today is just another opportunity for him and those who do agree and those who don't, for us to keep stirring the pot.

It's clear that Milloy is this community's pinata.

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 11:38 am • link • report

Wait, just had a thought. Is this the same Bus Depot as the Springarm facility that McDuffie does not support?

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 11:39 am • link • report

I am perplexed how locating a bus depot in Ivy City will advance the gentrification of Ivy City.

by AWalkerInTheCity on Dec 12, 2012 11:42 am • link • report

@Phil,

Apparently that was no problem for him, but yet he claims it would be a grievous harm to current DC residents.

Don't you know the folks who care most about the poorest DC residents are the ones who packed up and moved out of the District? And no longer pay any DC taxes that those poor depend on? And fervently support policies to concentrate as many of the region's poor inside DC where they won't have to contribute anything to their welfare...other than snark about bike lanes, dog parks, and the myopia of middle-class residents who actually *do* foot the bill?

by oboe on Dec 12, 2012 11:44 am • link • report

Hog, he is one of WaPo's most regular commentors on urban issues - seems natural for folks here to respond to him.

now. Do you think that the Mayor's support for the bus depot is part of a plan to drive poor people from the District? That absent such a plan, it would not have been proposed?

by AWalkerInTheCity on Dec 12, 2012 11:44 am • link • report

Yeah, how dare we make fun of Milloy for quoting a twelve year old when, if you care to read the article, quotes a twelve year old boy who somehow perfectly expresses Milloy's general quips about what he sees as DCs priorities.

Even without the code words from the other article, Milloy is making stupid arguments on their face, regardless of intent. If you do so continuously then exepct to be called out.

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 11:47 am • link • report

It's clear that Milloy is this community's pinata.

What's clear is that the man is a racist fool.

by Vinh An Nguyen on Dec 12, 2012 11:48 am • link • report

I wouldn't say Mara is a shoe in. Even with so many candidates filing, there is opportunity to get behind a single democrat for the seat.

by William on Dec 12, 2012 11:48 am • link • report

@AWalkerInTheCity and ceefer66:

Let's not forget that Friendship Heights also has a bus depot that some people there are actively seeking to maintain. I don't think the Nordstrom, Elizabeth Arden Spa, and Cheesecake Factory mind it too much. Not to mention the Saks Fifth Avenue and Cartier stores up the street on the Maryland side...

by Teyo on Dec 12, 2012 11:48 am • link • report

Council member Yvette Alexander (D-Ward 7) said the District should adopt red as a uniform color to distinguish the city’s cabs from those in New York and other big cities.

This could be the dumbest contribution to this whole ridiculous debate. Why on Earth should this be a consideration? Is there some sort of advantage to creating a distinct brand for DC taxis? Or are there "New York cabs" trolling the streets of DC which would confuse potential fares? Sheesh.

by oboe on Dec 12, 2012 11:52 am • link • report

@HogWash and @ceefer66, if you check the comments above, most people here oppose the Ivy City bus depot proposal and are glad that the courts stepped in.

We just don't believe that the depot was part of "The Plan".

If I say that 5+3 is 8 because magical nerd pixies make it so, I'm wrong even though I technically got the right answer. Likewise, Milloy is correct to oppose the bus depot, but his reasoning is pure magical nerd pixies.

by cminus on Dec 12, 2012 11:55 am • link • report

@Teyo

Let's not forget that Friendship Heights also has a bus depot that some people there are actively seeking to maintain

As the result of its demise would be redevelopment of that site, which many in this neighborhood see as an absolute worst case scenario.

by Kyle-W on Dec 12, 2012 12:13 pm • link • report

RE Norfolk Amtrak... Props to Virginia, and also Gov. McDonnell for cheer leading this rail expansion while so many other states are falling behind. Hopefully my home state, North Carolina, will continue to follow your lead. (The last time we followed Virginia's lead, things didn't work out all that well for us). So far, NC's new leadership hasn't been ideologically opposed to rail; their only argument against passenger rail has been that expansion would interfere with our state-owned freight rail operation.

I'm sure my folks are happy that they don't have to drive to Newport News to pick me up when I go home for Christmas this year. They weren't pleased about the 4:50 AM return ticket, but once they realized that I could get back to DC and still get a full day's work in... well, now they know that I have one less excuse to not visit home more often.

by Steven Harrell on Dec 12, 2012 12:17 pm • link • report

@oboe

Whats makes CM Alexander's comments even dumber is that if DC cabs were mistaken for cabs from another jurisdiction, it would likely be Arlington's cabs. And those are red!

by Falls Church on Dec 12, 2012 12:19 pm • link • report

I'd be interested to know whether that's why I've seen an MPD cruiser at the corner of 14th and Penn for the last 2 mornings. People heading westbound on Penn, not able to make a legal left, will often cross the intersection, make a U-turn, and then turn right southbound onto 14th. HUGE props if that is, in fact, what that cruiser is there for. I'd just suggest mixing up the times it's there, though, as people make that U-turn any time there's not an obvious officer. Sure, I understand protecting people at the peak of rush hour, but randomness is often helpful in getting people into the habit of doing it right (by, oh, I dunno, driving one-half block north on 14th, and making 3 lefts to end up right back at the same spot with less than a square block of extra driving, or planning ahead so you don't find yourself facing that turn).

by Ms. D on Dec 12, 2012 12:22 pm • link • report

RG is spot on. It's the traffic on NY Ave, WV Ave, Mt. Olivet and Bladensburg that continues to hold down Ivy City.

by Col. Brentwood on Dec 12, 2012 12:36 pm • link • report

Do you think that the Mayor's support for the bus depot is part of a plan to drive poor people from the District?

No I don't..and I doubt most people do.

What's clear is that the man is a racist fool.

Well this coming from the person who also erroneously claimed that black folk's opposition to Rhee was based on race, you are hardly the best person to throw out the racist charge.

We just don't believe that the depot was part of "The Plan".

Of course you don't. You aren't poor. But I'm shocked that thinking people actually believe that there aren't some of the poor who DO believe they are being pushed out. I gathered that Milloy refers to those.

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 12:43 pm • link • report

Was this bus depot supposed to replace housing?

You aren't poor. But I'm shocked that thinking people actually believe that there aren't some of the poor who DO believe they are being pushed out.

I think we all believe it but think that A. they're wrong and the reasons for a push are reasons much more complex than be expressed in a single column. and B. in any case it's definitely not the bike lanes and dog parks at fault.

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 12:56 pm • link • report

And, most importantly, C: Milloy doesn't believe it for a second either. He's a troll, a race-baiter, and an exploiter of the very poor people he cynically claims to "represent".

by oboe on Dec 12, 2012 1:07 pm • link • report

they're wrong and the reasons for a push are reasons much more complex than be expressed in a single column. and B. in any case it's definitely not the bike lanes and dog parks at fault.

A. What you might not understand is that what you might consider irrational does not mean the same for someone else. I agree that it is complex but actually can be expressed in a single column.

B. I agree that it's not. It won't stop people from believing such silliness any more than people here (well mainly DC's nonblack folk) similarly believing that bike lanes are a proxy for white folk...or at least anytime CM mentions bike lanes.

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 1:10 pm • link • report

He's a troll, a race-baiter, and an exploiter of the very poor people he cynically claims to "represent".

There might be a smidgen of truth there. Seems like he employs the similar strategy of much of what I've seen from many people here. That is, they use people like Milloy, Barry (and now even Anita Bonds) to scare WOTR nonblacks into agreement..arguing that "THE MAN" is out to take DC from their "progressive" arms.

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 1:12 pm • link • report

Yes, I believe that if you think there is a conspiracy to drive out black residents of DC so that white people can move in again that you are irrational.

and I've personally said again and again, I don't really care if Milloy is being coded or not. His arguments are still dumb on their face, not to mention factually wrong. He's misleading no matter what his intent.

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 1:16 pm • link • report

Yes, I believe that if you think there is a conspiracy to drive out black residents of DC so that white people can move in again that you are irrational.

Not sure what you're referring to but that wasn't what the article was about. Did you read all of it? Or just the part where GGW accused him of doing what he did not?

He's misleading no matter what his intent

That too is possible, most for those who disagree.

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 1:44 pm • link • report

I think the Ivy City plan is a bad planned, poorly implemented, but just for fits and shingles, where would people like to see the buses go?

A little background here, the bus lot in Union Station has recently been modified to accommodate intracity buses (including a new Greyhound terminal). That means space for the previous customers, largely tour buses, has been curtailed. This poses a problem for me (I'm a tour guide, btw), as my groups often have lunch at Union Station. Without parking, I do one of two things: go elsewhere, or have my driver drive around for an hour or so while we eat/shop.

The first option is fine with me, although places to feed 55 students quickly and without advance notice are scarce. But it's gotten quite a bit of understandable pushback from vendors at Union Station, who kinda like have customers.

The second is also fine with me (actually, it's really not). It's tough on the driver of course, but without parking he'll probably just drive around while we eat.

My point is that while I can understand the environmental issues with buses, and with Ivy City, having them drive around town instead of going to a lot and shut down isn't better.

by Tim Krepp on Dec 12, 2012 2:01 pm • link • report

What you might not understand is that what you might consider irrational does not mean the same for someone else.

I was responding to you. Even if someone thinks "The Plan" is rational doesn't make it so.

He's misleading no matter what his intent

That too is possible, most for those who disagree.

So saying that DC cares more about bike lanes than jobs programs when the budget shows the opposite isn't misleading?

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 2:06 pm • link • report

So saying that DC cares more about bike lanes than jobs programs when the budget shows the opposite isn't misleading?

Not sure what you're reffering to here..certainly not the article in question.

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 2:26 pm • link • report

@drumz: the buses parked at the proposed site would be charter tour buses, mostly school groups, not intercity buses (which, last I checked, were well known for serving "poor residents"). What About The Children?!

by Payton on Dec 12, 2012 2:31 pm • link • report

For what its worth, DC has a very nice and very large Job Corps campus in Blue Plains (federal money, but still..). You can go there, for free, receive a paycheck while training, and come out as a trained plumber (which probably pays more and has more future job stability than a Washington Post columnist).

by dcdriver on Dec 12, 2012 2:34 pm • link • report

As for alternate locations, a quick look at the aerials shows that the USPS and WMATA have large, under-used parking lots along Brentwood. A short-term sublease could help out those two financially stressed agencies.

by Payton on Dec 12, 2012 2:36 pm • link • report

I think it is interesting that the bike lanes are getting a rich people only stereotype/reputation. Hopefully some of the mayor's constituents will turn against him so we can try to elect someone better next time.

by YeatesS on Dec 12, 2012 2:40 pm • link • report

Hogwash,

Do I really have to spell it out for you? Do you not remember a week or two ago? Are you messing with me?

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 2:47 pm • link • report

Do I really have to spell it out for you? Do you not remember a week or two ago? Are you messing with me?Oh sorry. Didn't realize we were back to discussing CM's throw away line GGW branded as racial coding.

I imagine this, like the myopic twit nonline, will go down in the annals of internet folklore. At least it's rather clear that is an important issue for nonblacks. Hence this constant, "how dare he talks about us" sort of pushback.

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 2:55 pm • link • report

I imagine this, like the myopic twit nonline, will go down in the annals of internet folklore. At least it's rather clear that is an important issue for nonblacks. Hence this constant, "how dare he talks about us" sort of pushback

by HogWash on Dec 12, 2012 2:56 pm • link • report

oboe +1 on taxi colors.

To be fair, Alexander also thinks our cheesesteaks should have Muscrat meet to distinguish them from Philly's, our stoplights should use purple, white and maroon to distinguish them from Chicago's and that our Orange Line metro should go by the name of "Beyonce Pad Thai" to distinguish it from LA's Orange line.

by David C on Dec 12, 2012 3:00 pm • link • report

who also erroneously claimed that black folk's opposition to Rhee was based on race

Oh right, I forgot you corrected me by saying that since blacks shop in Asian stores, they can't possibly be bigoted. I supposed you also think that there is no way a white guy who watches basketball and listens to rap can be racist.

by Vinh An Nguyen on Dec 12, 2012 3:01 pm • link • report

Perhaps the simplest way to establish a common livery and make taxis easily identifiable would be white with a red stripe from the nose, over the roof, and back down to the trunk. Easy to pick out from a distance, not hard to paint.

I'd also suggest removing the "Taxi call 911" sign from the top of every cab. I know foreign visitors who have, not unreasonably, dialled 911 thinking that was a taxi dispatch number. If the idea is to be an emergency beacon, it shouldn't be visible until activated. Bad design.

by phil on Dec 12, 2012 3:03 pm • link • report

But to suggest that Milloy "insists" this because a 12-yr old say so rests at the height of journalistic shenanigans gone rouge

Well it is inaccurate, but it's not nearly as bad as you make it sound.

Still this is basically your criticism of GGW? That they used the word "insist" instead of "implied" or more accurately "repeated"? Is that really worse than saying that "legal battles with the D.C. government offer evidence that The Plan is not some figment of poor folks’ imagination"? That statement is also false, and far more incendiary. I think your criticism is a bit misplaced.

by David C on Dec 12, 2012 3:11 pm • link • report

I imagine this, like the myopic twit nonline, will go down in the annals of internet folklore. At least it's rather clear that is an important issue for nonblacks.

And Courtland Milloy. He just lies and mischaracterizes to get his point across.

by drumz on Dec 12, 2012 3:18 pm • link • report

@ Col. Brentwood

If it is the traffic from avenues and roads around Ivy City that are holding it down please explain Mass, Connecticut, Wisconsin, Western, Eastern, Pennsylvania, Maryland and Michigan Avenues, South Capitol, North Capitol and East Capitol Streets

by kk on Dec 12, 2012 4:00 pm • link • report

Can we just stop pretending that the Plan doesn't exist and admit that it does, for goodness sake?!?! I'm white and made the decision 15 years ago to move to DC specifically to displace its black residents. I had a better job offer in Oklahoma, but there weren't enough black people there to displace. After getting a call from all the other whites, I agreed to move to Shaw. There. Now you know it's true.

by LetsBeHonest on Dec 12, 2012 4:12 pm • link • report

Good to see the investments VA is making in Amtrak. It's hard to believe Norfolk is just getting service now after 35 years.

FWIW, Norfolk is not the southernmost stop accessible from the NEC & DC. You can travel to Charlotte on the Carolinian and Miami via the Silver Star.

by Jonathan Parker on Dec 12, 2012 5:20 pm • link • report

Have you tried all these various routes yourself, kk? I don't own a car, or I'd offer to show you the difference. But if you'd like to spend two mornings with me, one walking a major commuter route in NE around Ivy City and another a major commuter route in NW, I'd be happy to join you. I'm sure you'll be able to see the difference, plainly.

by Ms. D on Dec 13, 2012 12:55 am • link • report

I agree, Ms. D, I've only driven on New York Ave but I have no problem believing it's a beast for pedestrians to walk along/cross.

by Alan B. on Dec 14, 2012 11:09 am • link • report

Alan, it's not just the quantity of the traffic, but its composition. The greater proportion of commercial/heavy vehicles burning diesel makes the air quality TERRIBLE in the vicinity of those roads. I'm lucky to live far enough away from all of them that it's not bad at my house. But I do have to cross a thoroughfare with heavy truck traffic and, let me tell you, there is a BIG difference between crossing that and crossing 14th St. once I make it downtown.

by Ms. D on Dec 14, 2012 2:41 pm • link • report