Metro trip planner suggests riding a bus in a loop

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Metro trip planner suggests riding a bus in a loop

by Michael Perkins • August 27, 2009 1:48 pm

Besides wanting to find out if they could get money from their data, Metro's other stated reason for not working partnering Google was the quality and availability of Metro's own trip planner. Sometimes, though, the trip planner gives bizarre results, even including riding a bus in a circle for an hour.

WMATA trip planner.

Most of the time, when I use the trip planner for rail trips, the results are fairly accurate. The interface is clunky but improving, and it seems to assume an unreasonably long time to make a transfer. This is probably a design decision to ensure that even the slowest-moving customers can catch their train.

But I recently was invited out to dinner at a restaurant at Fairfax Corner, out in the Fair Oaks area (see map). Using the Metro trip planner gave some interesting results, to say the least. If you'd like to try this, the search was from "Eastern Market" to "4250 Fairfax Corner Ave [Fairfax, VA]" leaving at 4:20pm on a workday. These were the trip planner's suggestions:

Take the Orange line to Vienna, wait 28 minutes to take the 623 past the restaurant (there's a stop about 0.3 miles from the restaurant), then get off at a park and ride and wait 24 minutes for the 605 going back the way you came, stopping at the restaurant you passed. Total time: 1:59.
Take the Orange line to West Falls Church, wait a few minutes and take the 505 to Reston, then wait 49 minutes to transfer to the 605 to the restaurant. Total time: 2:50.
(This is the really funny one) Take the Orange line to Vienna, wait 9 minutes to take the CUE-GOLD bus in a closed loop, arriving back at Vienna, then wait 57 minutes to take the 621 to the restaurant. Total time: 3:03, of which almost two hours is pure waste. It might as well have said, "Go to the Ugly Mug and drink for an hour and a half, then take the Orange line."

I looked into how stable this trip was, by varying the start time. Earlier departures resulted in earlier closed-loop rides on the CUE bus system, until the trip planner stopped providing that helpful suggestion (it only gave two options at that point). Later trips shifted to suggesting that instead of continuing on the Orange line to Vienna, I should get off at East Falls Church and take a bus (the 2) to Vienna (which takes 50 minutes instead of 10).

The real solution, after studying Fairfax Connector's bus map (large PDF), three bus schedules and calling the customer service phone number, is to take itinerary #1, get off a little beyond the restaurant and walk back along the route. It's less than a half mile and I'm in fair shape. That takes about an hour and a half.

Of course, it's not a given that Google would do any better. But Google has the incentive and resources to get their trip planner right. They're serving trip planner results for most of the country now, and problems with their search algorithm would affect many more riders than just Metro. Plus, with two trip planner choices, riders could use the better one. Maybe that'd be Metro's.

Others were able to point out very strange results from the planner, such as the suggestion to take a bus, Green line and Yellow line trains from "Greenbelt Center SC" to Huntington Metro station. The routing was correct, but it took over 7 hours for the train to get from Greenbelt to Fort Totten, and over an hour to get from Fort Totten to Huntington (This showed up on a search on 8/17/2009).

What's the strangest thing you've seen? Is the trip planner helpful? Please share your funny and/or strange trip planner results in the comments. Update by David: Metro officials in charge of the Web site have expressed interest in getting more feedback on times the trip planner falls short or other ways to improve it. We'll forward your useful bug reports and suggestions to them.

26 comments

Tags: data openness, websites, WMATA

Getting more out of Metro with "skip-stop" (Mar 4, 2009)
A better strategy for Orange Line shuttle buses? (May 25, 2010)
Metro's trip planner should offer service alerts (Jan 14, 2011)
New calendar shows scheduled Metro track work and delays (May 4, 2010)
Innovation resistance at Metro, part 4: What flaws? (Oct 5, 2009)

Michael Perkins blogs here and at Infosnack about Metro operations and fares, performance parking, and any other government and economics information he finds on the Web. He lives with his wife and two children in Arlington, Virginia.

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Glitches aside, I like maps. What WMATA's missing is the cross-platform integration that google offers, with me being able to visualize where it is I'll be going - not just have them search the various timetables.

Your example is a textbook case. You ended up looking at a map to see the best option, and if that kind of stuff was integrated into one platform, the user would get to make those choices.

If I'm trying to find out where to go, I don't pick a mode and a system first, then find my way there - but that's more or less what WMATA wants you to do with their trip planner.

They can insist for accuracy all they want, but there's a fundamental issue with their approach that no bug fix will resolve.

by Alex B. on Aug 27, 2009 2:41 pm

1) Travel from Federal Center to L'Enfant at 8am on a weekday, and it only returns orange line trains (no blue lines)

Basically the error is anywhere on the Blue-Orange and go only one stop and it only returns Orange line trains during rush hour.

2) Try traveling to Dunn Lorring, it always asks to you walk 0.08 miles from Dunn Lorring to Dunn Lorring.

3) When doing a search with the Georgia Ave station, its not clickable like every other station.

by Erik on Aug 27, 2009 2:49 pm

Call me immature, but I'm tremendously amused that your notional aimless wandering in circles began by setting out at 4:20.

by cminus on Aug 27, 2009 2:49 pm

I'm with Alex B. The first thing I do when planning a visit somewhere I've never been is to plot it on a map (yes, usually Google Maps). It's bad enough to try to figure out Metro's trip planner when you know the area, I'd be hesitant to rely upon it if you're a visitor or new here.

A map provides a good sanity check that the route you're given makes sense, avoiding problems referenced in the article above.

by TimK on Aug 27, 2009 2:51 pm

I wonder if this is a symptom of the trip planner being forced to give you multiple options when there's really only one real option? I've used it before when I know I'm going from one stop on a bus line to another stop on the same line, and even though there's a direct route, the thing insists on giving me both the direct route and bizarre directions to go way, way out of my way to get to the destination.

In the early days of it when I lived in Mt. Pleasant on 16th Street and would ask to go to, say, Dupont, it would have me bus to McPherson Square, ride the Orange (always Orange) to Metro Center, then take the red line up to Dupont. Or walk to Columbia Heights, take it going north to Fort Totten (!!), then ride the red over to Dupont. Was always amusing to see those bizarro directions in the 2nd and 3rd spots.

by Moose on Aug 27, 2009 3:27 pm

Yeah, I just tried punching in my normal work commute. Instead of my usual walk to metro, transfer lines, walk to work - it gave me a bus ride to another metro station (no transfer).

The thing is, their top choice was the one that took about 10 minutes longer and cost more money.

I realize WMATA's a little hard up for money, but come on.

by Alex B. on Aug 27, 2009 3:35 pm

Yep, I always look at the location on a map first. If I'm taking a bus, I usually look at a map of the bus route, too.

In Metro's defense, I do this when I travel in other cities, too -- even with driving directions. I don't trust Mapquest, the GPS, whatever to "just work", especially if it's somewhere I haven't been before -- it's always useful to have a point of reference to see whether the directions make sense.

One nice thing about the trip planner is it links you directly to the route map for that bus. If there was a link/integration to a general street map (e.g. Google Maps) too, it'd save opening another tab.

by Gavin Baker on Aug 27, 2009 3:46 pm

Write a blog about it....

oh wait...

by Mike2 on Aug 27, 2009 3:52 pm

one of the nice features of Google Maps is that it, you know, works. :)

buurn. ha ha. ok. moving on.

but it also has permalinks to the directions. so, let's say you want to share with a friend some directions for how to get from NY, NY to Brooklyn, NY -- well, it's easy to do with Google Maps.

and these features that are offered by Google Maps are only going to multiply and continue to go above and beyond what any single US transit agency can offer -- because Google only has to build these features once, the scale that they can achieve is already unmatched, and more and more transit agencies are onboarding all the time -- here in the US and abroad. maybe WMATA has the money to compete with google on technology, but I'd rather WMATA spend our money a bit more judiciously.

by Peter Smith on Aug 27, 2009 4:02 pm

To be fair, the lack of WMATA data on gmaps is not the only thing holding this trip plan back. Fairfax Connector also hasn't shared their data. So while Fairfax City's CUE is up on gmaps, and the Vienna station is recognized, the trip still isn't possible even if you get directions from Vienna to 4250 Fairfax Corner Ave.

by kidincredible on Aug 27, 2009 5:37 pm

When I lived in London, I used the London Underground's trip planner and it allowed you to choose your walking speed as well as maximum walking distance. That would solve a lot of problems for me with the trip planner, which often suggests I use transit when walking for part of the trip makes much more sense.

by Jeff on Aug 27, 2009 5:46 pm

Check out this blog post for another great example of why I never rely on the trip planner:
http://bit.ly/DvTfN

I don't know if it still does this, but it used to not think that the Pentagon Metrorail connected with the Pentagon bus bays.

Also, when going into DC on the Orange Line from East Falls Church, it has told me to go to West Falls Church first, then wait and take the Orange Line going back in. It still does this sometimes (usually the 3rd option).

On any trip that requires a transfer, I always, always do additional legwork with the actual schedules and maps. Most of the time I am able to find a better option than the trip planner.

by Steve O on Aug 27, 2009 5:58 pm

Ugly Mug? What time?

by JMS on Aug 27, 2009 6:33 pm

Kidincredible, WMATA is the 800 lb gorilla in the region. If WMATA were to negotiate acceptable terms to get their data into Google maps, other agencies would feel pressure to follow.

It doesn't really work the other way though. I bet hardly anyone knew that CUE and DASH were in Google Maps. When WMATA joins, it will be B-section of the Post news.

by Michael Perkins on Aug 27, 2009 9:41 pm

Google Maps... driving... 37 minutes. ::sigh::

by Bossi on Aug 28, 2009 9:43 am

Speaking of third-party websites with trip planners, how does hopstop.com (which works great for NYC, not so much for DC) have access to WMATA data? Is there an agreement with WMATA - why them and not Google? If you're not familiar with the site, you can plot your origin or destination on a map, and has extremely detailed directions allowing time for things like taking the escalator down into the metro station. A pretty good site but it's no Google Maps..

by orangeliner on Aug 28, 2009 11:03 am

We're trying to make life easier for walkers in London and a lot of other UK cities.

We haven't got all the answers, but sometimes just using shank's pony can be a lot less complicated than messing around with buses and tubes...

by Jamie on Aug 28, 2009 12:24 pm

First of all, I want to say the the trip planner is pretty good and I'm glad it exists at all...it keeps me from having to look at the DC bus map, which I can never read right (and I have a masters in urban planning!) and which always crashes my computer. It also keeps me from having to remember which bus to take for the routes I don't use that frequently, like the H2/H4 when I want to buy wet cat food at the CH Giant and dry cat food at the Cleveland Park Petco (don't ask. I have a picky cat).

My biggest problem, especially now that I live by the SW Waterfront, is that the trip planner doesn't include the Circulator. Tonight I'm going home from Adams Morgan around 9:30. To me an obvious answer is the Circulator to CH or U St. and metro home (because even if the Woodley Park and Waterfront circulators met up someplace, the Waterfront Circulator only runs til 9pm), but the top result on Trip Planner is some malarkey about the 96 and the 70 bus (the 96 sure as heck doesn't run every 10 minutes at night and the 70 bus stops a quarter mile, not half a block, from my apartment). Option #2 isn't terrible (96 bus to U st and metro home) and Option # 3 involves taking a bus to the Anacostia metro and metro home, which is just dumb. I mean, if you want to put something out-of-the-way and time-consuming, why not "walk to Woodley Park and take the Metro home" as option 3?

I agree that including an option for longer walking distance would be great, and would love to see maps near in the results. I also think the algorithm should privilege buses that run more frequently over those that get you a block or two closer to your destination but only run every half hour or something.

by Stacy on Aug 28, 2009 1:02 pm

What if there were an option to choose your walking speed, and it'd consider the distance & walking speed as part of the time calculations? Perhaps you'd just pick fast, average, or slow; corresponding to something like 5, 4, and 3 ft/s. ...Although that would necessitate that it look at a layer

by Bossi on Aug 28, 2009 1:55 pm

I've seen a few weird ones. I just got this as my 3rd option for going from Shirlington to Pentagon at 3:10 today:

Walk from Shirlington to Shirlington Transit Center.
Take 25A bus to Pentagon Bus Terminal at 3:20.
Transfer to 24P bus at 3:40.
Exit 24P at Army Navy Drive and Fern St.
Walk to Pentagon.
Uh huh.

by D Murphy on Aug 28, 2009 2:59 pm

I think that's what the London Underground trip planner does

by Jeff on Aug 28, 2009 2:59 pm

@D Murphy. Wouldn't it be great to just have a simple pocket schedule for the 165 buses/day that run between Pentagon & Shirlington? It would take about 3 seconds to look it up; no computer required. And no silliness like option 3.
http://bit.ly/xJ7Kk

by Steve O on Aug 28, 2009 4:04 pm

Often a search for a trip originating at Southern Towers apartments in VA going to a Orange line station in VA will tell you to take the bus to Pentagon (yes, that's the fastest), but then will put you on a Yellow line train to L'Efant to connect to an Orange Line train traveling to VA. This adds 6 stops to your trip.

I have never seen it display an option of taking the blue line to Rosslyn and transferring to an Orange line train.

Bus schedules leave a lot to be desired as well, especially the maps. When you have a moment check out the 25B map. Bus goes in a circle around the Skyline area and unless you are familiar with the route you never know where to get on or off the bus.

by Cdubs on Aug 31, 2009 8:03 pm

Going back to orangeliner's question, Hopstop's staff wrote me back and told me that their data came from screen scraping and meticulous data entry (they copied it in from schedules by hand).

by Michael Perkins on Oct 1, 2009 9:06 am

Yesterday i plugged in Metro Center to 7800 Wisconsin Ave in Bethesda. It told me to take the metro to Medical Center and then get on a bus down the block.

I looked at a map and it was a 3 block walk from the Bethesda metro station.

by Melissa on Oct 1, 2009 2:30 pm